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As We Are: Obese People

AIR DATE: Thursday, August 7th 2008

Download the mp3 for this show.

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What does it feel like to live inside an obese body?

Prejudice about obesity abounds. A person's weight can influence how other people view their intelligence, their personal habits and their work ethic. Obesity is a significant issue in Oregon, where some estimates say as much as 25 percent of the population is currently obese, and up to 62 percent of the state's residents are overweight. The fat acceptance movement, formed to combat discrimination against overweight people, is going strong in the Northwest.

While the national rise in obesity rates has been well-documented in the media, the stories of individuals experiencing obesity have been less prominent. How do people become obese? What does it feel like to live inside an obese body? How does that impact a person's daily life? The second conversation in our occasional series As We Are will bring together people who are obese and ask them these and other questions.

What about you? Are you -- or have you ever been -- really overweight? Has it impacted your health, your ability to travel, or your work? Have you lost a lot of weight? Or is weight loss not important to you?

UPDATE: As we've been working on this show, we've gotten a few comments from people who identify as "fat" who wish that we would not use the word "obese" when broaching this topic. If you are significantly overweight, what words do you use when referring to your own body? What words make you most comfortable?

GUESTS:

• Gina Carter
• Will Newman
• Carrie Padian

Photo credit: Darren Hester / Flickr / Creative Commons

Tagged as: as we are · health · lifestyle · obesity

We hear a lot about obesity these days and the usual solutions range from gastric bypass surgery to the inevitable plea for diet and exercise. But with all this attention, there's one aspect of obesity no one's really talking about. I discovered this missing link when I started working with two clients, sisters and nurses, both of them morbidly obese. The problem? They couldn't do the same kinds of exercises as other clients because of their size...the machines were too small for them and some exercises were just downright impossible. Together, we've come up with some solutions to these problems and, if you're in the same boat, you can too.

=========================

mike

========================

the grapefruit diet

sameer9 — Fri June 5th 12:16p.m.

I have lived in Europe, and every time I fly back here I'm blown away when I leave the plane and airport and see how fat everyone is. I get that there are complex metabolic processes involved, and that not everyone can control their weight due to those things. But let's face it. People in Europe presumably have the same biology, and their population is much less fat. We do make choices. MOST people who are fat are fat due to their choices. So I would favor higher fees/deductibles for medical insurance for them (but not if they have relevant biological issues that prevent them from losing weight), and YES, also for those who smoke, don't wear helmets, etc. We charge people more for risky driving habits and for choosing homes on flood plains. Charging more for risky health choices just makes sense. And yes, I would favor coverage for classes and medical care to encourage weight loss, smoking cessation, etc. Some will argue that this is heartless, but right now we have all kinds of things that aren't covered (I once saw a show about kids' prosthetic devices not being covered because they grow so fast and there's a limit) because the system has to pay for medical problems that are preventable with reasonable life habits. We need to have compassion for them, too.

pdxwriter — Fri July 17th 9:07p.m.

I have lived in Europe, and every time I fly back here I'm blown away when I leave the plane and airport and see how fat everyone is. I get that there are complex metabolic processes involved, and that not everyone can control their weight due to those things. But let's face it. People in Europe presumably have the same biology, and their population is much less fat. We do make choices. MOST people who are fat are fat due to their choices. So I would favor higher fees/deductibles for medical insurance for them (but not if they have relevant biological issues that prevent them from losing weight), and YES, also for those who smoke, don't wear helmets, etc. We charge people more for risky driving habits and for choosing homes on flood plains. Charging more for risky health choices just makes sense. And yes, I would favor coverage for classes and medical care to encourage weight loss, smoking cessation, etc. Some will argue that this is heartless, but right now we have all kinds of things that aren't covered (I once saw a show about kids' prosthetic devices not being covered because they grow so fast and there's a limit) because the system has to pay for medical problems that are preventable with reasonable life habits. We need to have compassion for them, too.

pdxwriter — Fri July 17th 9:07p.m.

I just mentioned on another forum how ironic it is that the Chinese are getting off their bicycles and buying new cars while the Americans are getting out of their cars and buying new bicycles. The Chinese will get less healthy and the Americans will get more healthy. Economic growth will make the Chinese less healthy and economic recession is making Americans more healthy.


Alice! Gimme that Looking Glass!

Tom D Ford — Thu July 24th 8:29p.m.

Do you ride long distances in Portland? I started riding up to 40 miles and after a month of this I was coughing fur balls. Wonder whether riding a bike in Portland is actually that healthy. Yes, you might get exercise on one hand, but you might be irreparably damaging your lungs on the other. I lived in Hood River for several years and the air quality "seemed" a lot better. Of course I wondered about pesticide drift and cow farts from the desert, but that's another issue isn't it? Good luck, stay on your bike.

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:26p.m.

My best friend is 6ft 550 lbs. He is 28 years old, and I have had to take him to the emergency room 5 times since high school because he thought he was having a heart attack. Ironically, I had to take him even though I thought it was impossible for a 20 year old man to have a heart attack (well not impossible, but not probable) because he was so overweight. In 1998, he weighed 290 and considered himself to be morbidly obese at that weight. Now he struggles with all kinds of issues because he is approaching twice his old weight.

I paid for his bus ticket to try out for the biggest loser season 3 (he weighed in at 448 back then) but they turned him down in the last cut before final rosters for the show. He has tried the subway diet, low carb diet, liquid diet, just about everything there is.

My plan now is to make a movie about him called 'Un-Super Size Me'. We are going to put him out in the middle of nowhere with a trainer/nurse with nothing but a weeks worth of food at a time. There will be no entertainment, just a clock with a paper on either side, one paper with a list of workouts and times and the other paper with what to eat at what time. His largest excuse for not losing weight is life. So we take everything away and he will have no excuses. The only thing he has to think about everyday is losing weight. I will go out and film him doing his workouts every sunday and bring him his next weeks worth of food.

We figure either he will eat me when I go out there, he will die from a heart attack, or he will indeed lose weight over the course of three months that we are filming. However it turns out, it should make for a pretty interesting documentary.

textchampion — Fri July 25th 1:33p.m.

I hope that you're getting a doctor involved. And good luck to both of you. Um, and the trainer/nurse.

I learned long ago that heavy people might look weak but they have to be very strong to carry the weight.

Tom D Ford — Fri July 25th 7:56p.m.

Oh definitely, the doctor is a must. He is actually in touch with his doctor probably more then any other person in his life. And yes, he is quite strong, and extremely agile for his size. That is what made me the most upset about him getting passed up for the biggest loser, and it's whats going to make our movie entertaining. He has a bachelor's degree in health (ironic, I know) and he has a tumbling routine that he had to compile as part of his degree. It should be video gold.

textchampion — Sun July 27th 1:07a.m.

That would be interesting. I think large humans get short shrift in society. I watched a very heavy woman once doing ballet and her grace brought tears to my eyes. Athletics, dance, fashion modeling, any movement types tend to get given over to the tall and lean types, and they're really the genetic rarities and don't represent anywhere near the norms or the entire range.

My mom had a great girlfriend who could just bob in the ocean, she floated so well because of her fat self. She was a delight to be around.

Tom D Ford — Sun July 27th 6:22p.m.

You might also want a psychologist/therapist/motivational person on the team. Your friend's problems may be more in his head. he could reduce food consumption, exercise like a freak, but if he doesn't fix his head the weight might return with a vengeance. More insight is required into his issues. Thank you for being his friend and helping.

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:34p.m.

Good point.

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 1:47p.m.

I still weigh what I did in high school 40 years ago (160 lbs) and the primary reason for that is the choices I've made.
For most (not all) people obesity is a choice and the rest of us pay to support their lifestyle through increasing medical and insurance costs and through tax dollars spent to alter public facilities to accomodate them.
If you think fat is beautiful, fine... Just don't ask me to pay for it.

John in Salem — Tue July 29th 12:19p.m.

I am tired of obese people making excuses for themselves.  Keeping weight off is HARD WORK.  I make choices every day to not overeat (and fail quite often), but extra calories in the mouth translates into fat being stored on the body.  People who are overweight or obese in most cases consume more calories than they burn.  End of story.  Stop making excuses and watch what you eat and how many calories you burn.  At the very least, stop making the rest of us look at you in your low-cut pants, tops, and tight-fitting clothing.  (...and I don't like that type of dress on skinny people either).

bimmerboomer — Wed Oct. 14th 3:39p.m.

I think that a lot of people who are obese started to get that way through their own choices, but then it quickly deteriorates into learned helplessness and bad habits, which are not entirely within one's scope of control.

There can be a balance between improving the health of our citizens and allowing people to make their own (good or bad) choices. I agree that people who are obese should not be a drag on others' wallets, but they should get the support needed to get to a healthy weight.

h.m.currey — Tue July 29th 12:52p.m.

So, you are willing to pay for diabetes care for a thin person but not a fat person? Why? Because they can "help it". Thin people die of diabetes, cancer and all the other things, too. What about people who go hiking and get lost, or people who ride bikes and motorcycles without helmets, aren't you paying for them, too? Or smokers? What about heavy drinkers? Would you only not be okay with it if they were fat?

There are any number of "identifies" that cost society more. Men for example cost much more in medical bills, but we do not consider them "optional".

I think the idea that "it is okay with me, except when it costs me" is just an excuse for fat hatred.

And actually, Fat Hatred is something that contributes to bad health. Fat people feel depressed because of how they are treated and they don't work out as much because of the way they are treated, this contributes to poor health.

If the government REALLY cared about fat people's health they would start fat gyms and community centers where people could work out without being humiliated. But, of course they wouldn't do that because that would COST them money and the way things are now is MAKING them money - loads of it.

fatandfine — Wed Aug. 6th 5:15p.m.

Typically a thin person with diabetes has Type I diabetes, an auto-immune disorder that attacks the insulin producing cells in the pancreas. Without insulin they cannot utilize the carbohydrates they ingest. Type II diabetes results from eating too many carbohydrates and desensitizing cells. It is often called diet-controlled diabetes because when people with Type II diabetes watch what they eat, exercise and lose weight they often see a lessening of the severity of their diabetes. Some people even lose the diagnosis of diabetes.

I know many "fat" people and love them. They're beautiful, intelligent, funny and NOT (NOT!) lazy.

Even so, we can't hide from the consequences of our actions.

Morrolan — Thu Aug. 7th 12:18a.m.

Silly argument. All of these COST us more, everyone of us that pays taxes and pays for health insurance or works for a company that buys insurance for their employees. It is naive at best to assume that adding one more health risk, and YES it IS a health risk to be OBESE and yes, you are obese if you are over 30 lbs over wieght. The human body is not designed to be fat, which is why there were likely no fat cave dwellers as humans evolved. It was a subsistence existence. So yes, obesity costs us ALL.
I really am tired of hearing obese people complain about how they are treated. Either do something about it or deal with it.

echolynch — Thu Aug. 7th 12:42p.m.

I was wondering why you believe that fat people cost taxpayers money? Do you have research that supports this claim?

As one of those fat people, I can assure you that health insurance providers spend less on me because I avoid the humiliation and embarrasment of doctor visits. I never find public facilities being renovated with tax dollars to make it easier for my butt to fit in a seat, to comfortably use a restroom, or escort me in a vehicle instead of walk.

If I choose to be fat, then you choose to be ignorant.

krutledge — Wed Aug. 13th 9:53p.m.

In history there were times that obesity meant that the person was the most well off in the community, they were the leaders in the community who could afford to eat that much, I think of royalty of Hawai'i for example. And of Feudal Europe. Now the wealthy think that thin is in and obesity is on the outs.

Ah, fashion, how it changes over time.

Tom D Ford — Tue July 29th 10:59p.m.

You have made 2 comments relating to economic structures and obesity concerns. To be fair we need to recognize that economics and health are intrinsically related. Studies of modern American habits have shown that lower income brackets have a higher propensity towards obesity. This is due, in part, to the rise in food costs, longer working hours and the growth of the prepared food industry, giving a working family the chance to eat in expedience after a long day's work. Thus your first "off the cuff" comment about China and bicyclists is off base given the social structures in place in both China and America.

Your second comment regarding the wealthy of yesterday in relation to the wealthy of today is also misleading and seems to accept that it is ok to don an unhealthy lifestyle for fashion. (Let?s face it, too thin is just as unhealthy as too fat)

amy-OR — Wed July 30th 2:08p.m.

I have read your comment.

Tom D Ford — Wed July 30th 4p.m.

I am obese, and I have been for most of my life. The funny thing is that when I weighed more (in my 30s), I was far more active and healthy. I hiked, biked, played softball, went camping, gardened...my blood pressure was always normal...so were cholesterol, triglycerides, glucose, etc.

Now, I weigh less than I did back then and I am not active or particularly healthy...because of post-polio effects, and a destroyed ankle. My activity and energy levels are severely restricted these days. I was temporarily abled and am becoming progressively more disabled (and there's a whole nother TOL conversation to have), irrespective of my weight.

To illustrate that it's not as simple as some would think, my husband, whose weight has stayed about the same and only slightly higher than my own for the 17 years I've known him, eats 3-4 times as much food as I do. According to the popular myth, he should be a giant by now. But he's not. He also poops about 3 times what I do. (A new area for research? Have scientists looked at the "output" part of the equation? I haven't heard of any research.)

Don't make assumptions about how much or what I eat based on my current size. I probably eat a whole lot healthier than you.

Fat does not equal unhealthy. Skinny does not equal healthy. Calorie reduction is a necessary piece of weight reduction, but it is not, in and of itself, sufficient. There are many studies coming out showing how complex the genetic, endocrine and neurotransmitter actions are that regulate appetite, fat storage, fat release, metabolism and obesity...not to mention the endocrine disorders associated with obesity such as diabetes. (And note: "associated with" does NOT mean "caused by". There is a great deal of debate in the scientific community about the causal relationships.)

I was happy, comfortable, loved and active in an obese body. I'm still in an obese body...just not as obese. And while I am still happy, and loved, I am uncomfortable from chronic pain and increasing loss of use of my body; flatly unable to be active no matter how much I might wish to be.

And the obesity is orthogonal to all that.

deborah ruppert — Mon Aug. 4th 4:59p.m.

I?m fat. Always have been and, I'm sure, always will be. I wrote about what it was like living in my body at 500+ pounds and why I had decided to have weight loss surgery, even though I view it as over-performed and dangerous. Entry here. (The comments had to be closed due to massive amounts of trolling when it was featured on reddit, digg, something awful, and several other sites a few weeks ago.)

When I had surgery I weighed 550 pounds and was 5?6? tall. I was no longer able to work and could barely walk more than a few feet a time. I was on medication for high blood pressure and for my blood sugar. I was in pain every moment of every day.

It was the hardest thing I ever did. I consider myself fat positive/accepting and had to admit that my body was collapsing and I could feel myself dying. I had to admit that I wasn?t a healthy fat person. That I had failed. But it was the right decision for me.

It?s been nine months since my surgery and I currently weigh 351 pounds. Meaning I?ve lost 199 pounds in that time. It?s weird and difficult and exciting and embarrassing and all these other things mixed together.

And as happy and amazing as it is to feel healthier and stronger and to finally do all these things again that so many people take for granted... I still struggle when complimented on my weight loss because, politically and philosophically, I have a problem with it. I still struggle to not fall into the insanely disordered eating pattern I?ve followed my whole life. I still struggle with having done something I?m opposed to.

When my body is done losing weight I believe I?ll still be fat. How fat, I don?t know. But fat. And I?m happy with that. Fat is something I?ve always been. And, given the choice, I wouldn?t want to be anything else.

thesugarmonster — Wed Aug. 6th 12a.m.

Folks, the particular page that thesugarmonster linked to seems to be down, but you can find her blog here:

http://thesugarmonster.livejournal.com/

David Miller — Thu Aug. 7th 11a.m.

Thank you so much for pointing that out!

Here it is again, as I can't figure out how to edit my initial comment!

Weight Loss Surgery and Why I'm Having It

thesugarmonster — Thu Aug. 7th 7:07p.m.

I am a 43 year old woman who is 5' 10" and weighs 400 pounds. I am fat. I am large. I am even super fat, but don't call me obese. Obese is a medical term that has been used to make us less human, to refer to us as a "problem". We are people. We are your friends, mothers, sisters, grandfathers, uncles and children. Everyone knows someone who is fat, would you love them more if they were thin?

You asked what it is like being a fat person - this is what it is like - having to fight, argue, reason, explain and configure all the time. It is exhausting sometimes just trying to get people to look at you as an equal. Fat people are everywhere and have contributed to all human achievements. We are healthy and not healthy - just like any other group of people divided by their looks - and yet this is the only thing that we are "judged" on. Why are we being judged at all?

Why is it okay for someone to make judgments about my body, to make comments and assume I eat badly. Why is it even any of their business? Why have we all become some sort of health police? People seem to find some sort of moral one-upsmanship in it.

But, since that is the most likely going to come up I will say I have always been big, but have seemed to gain about 10 pounds a year since I was 18. I can trace it to the line of work I have done. The more "successful" I became the more sedentary I became. From a person with a service job to a desk job. I do exercise a couple of times a week, but with a full time job and errands and house cleaning, it is hard to fit it in everyday. I eat healthier than almost all the people I know (they tell me this, I am not making the call) and my diet is mostly vegetarian with a little bit of salmon every week.I do not drink sodas much or eat fast food much and yet this is what the media says I do all the time.

And of course none of this is any one's business and I hope you can see the ridiculousness of having to constantly have to explain yourself. This is what being fat is like.

As far as being in this body. Yes, it is hard sometimes. I can't fit in some chairs, I can't do some things other people do. Some moves are out of reach for me in Yoga and I do get winded climbing stairs. Yes, my body has limitations. Many peoples bodies do. These people are sometimes fat and sometimes not. My body is healthy and working okay. No problems with blood work, no diabetes or any other issues and I am seldom sick. I would like to work out more for ease of movement and well-being, and hopefully I will. However, I am not about to cut into this body or shock it with diets just to lose weight. This is me. And as long as I am taking care of myself I am fine with it - so, why can't everyone else be?

krissy — Wed Aug. 6th 2:35p.m.

You know the equation is simple if you take in more calories than you need to survive then you will gain weight. A pound is about 3500 calories. If you are 200 pounds overweight that means that you took in 700,000 more calories than you needed to. Granted everyone's body is different but 240 pounds outside the general healthy weight range is not a abnormality in bone density that just makes you heavier. And don't tell me that some people gain weight faster than others and there metabolism is slower. That means that they need less calories to survive than a person with a faster metabolism and therefore should eat less. Making excuses and accepting everyone the way they are just because "that's how they choose to live their lives" is a cop out and an excuse to justify their overconsumption.

I have relatives and acquaintances that are obese (notice no close friends) and I would not care for them any less because of it but it would stop me from becoming close to them just as someone who smokes would be less likely to be my close friend. It is not just a physical appearance it is a reflection of how you live your life and what you think of yourself. The math is simple the excuses you make for yourself are not so easy to explain. Stop feeling sorry for yourself did you ever think that just by not being obese people have morally one upped you.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 11:06a.m.

Have you ever stopped to consider that many people have problems with their head when it comes to their excess weight? It's not as simple as counting calories and getting more exercise. They may have psychological issues they need to address. Please be less absolutist and more understanding. Most of the large people I hear don't want to be overweight and unhealthy. They are making excuses perhaps. Why? It's not so simple as you claim or there would be fewer large people don't you think?

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:45p.m.

Imagine?.

- Not being able to go into any store you want to buy clothes?or not being able to find any clothes your size in any store.
- Going to a grocery store and having perfect strangers comment about your food choices.
- Being ridiculed when you exercise in public.
- Being ridiculed when you blog about exercising.
- Friends, family, or perfect strangers feeling they have a right to comment on your lifestyle choices.
- Getting the message that you are the cause (or the best analogy for) global warming, the healthcare crisis, the food crisis, etc.
- Having people make assumptions about what, how much and where you eat.
- Having people make assumptions about how much or how you exercise (or don?t).
- Being told by your company (or a possible boss, or an adoption agency) that you are not capable of doing your job.
- Having someone need to do a study to show that people like you are actually productive members of a society.
- Having people assume you smell, even before they meet you.
- Having people assume that your partner has some sort of fetish because s/he is attracted to you.
- Working for a company only to be told by that company that you need to pay a fine or pay more for benefits because of personal characteristics.
- Having people tell you over and over that dieting and exercise works for everyone, when in fact about 95% of people who lose weight are unable to maintain that loss.
- Having people assume that those who weigh what you do are completely unable to move ? when you move just fine.
- Going to a movie, to get on a bus, to take a flight, to a restaurant, to the doctor?s office, etc. and knowing that there will not be a place for you to sit that is comfortable, if you can fit into the seats provided at all.
- Knowing that the fact that you can?t fit into a seat is going to annoy those around you and may result in rude things being said to you.
- Going to a doctor for something unrelated to your weight and having said doctor tell you that you just need to lose weight.
- Knowing that if you lose your job for any reason and try to get private health insurance, that you will likely be denied.

These are just a few of the ways that people who are fat may experience this world.

puppylove — Wed Aug. 6th 2:35p.m.

Good. Oh I'm sorry that you can't wear cloths that don't fit you. Since when did being obese(and I mean obese, fat is not the same as obese, which implies the amount of disgust that should accompany such awful overconsumption) become something that just happened to you. Because obese people never over ate and always exercised like they should. No, its a choice and a selfish one at that. If nothing else consider the fact that you are taking in way more food than is necessary to survive. Being obese and being okay with it is just a sense of entitlement that people really should not have.

Why do people discriminate against drug addicts or alcoholics, if thats how they want to live they should be aloud to. America is an ugly place where people think that they deserve as much food as they can possibly fit inside themselves and that what is good for the world is of no consequence. I know this view won't be popular just don't get grease from that cheese burger on the key board while you are crucifying me.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 1:57a.m.

Dear arsmorriende,

Your assumptions about what fat people eat are not necessarily true. Research is now beginning to reveal a whole host of brain and cellular chemical reactions that mediate hunger, satiation, and the utilization/storage of food energy. Stay posted: the next generation may have new tools to work with physical genotypes that might allow nearly everyone to stay within a more average weight range, without severe deprivation.

And I can attest that severe deprivation, constant hunger, feeling cold, weak, tired or depressed, are what it takes for some people to maintain a weight that you would apparently approve of. I know this because it's the story of my life.

I'm currently clinically obese, a situation that has arisen gradually over the last 16 years or so of my 60-plus years. Before that I stayed slim to barely-plump, depending on whether I was starving or only nearly starving. My family body type is compact and heavy, and my grandmother, mother, three sisters and daughter are all constantly on a weight-loss treadmill, and all gradually losing the fight.

I still eat as I did in my 20's, very attentive to the latest understandings of what a well-balanced diet should look like. I currently eat 1200 to 1300 calories a day, carefully chosen. I avoid sugar, fat, and starches. I pretty much live on salad. I eat a "fast food" sandwich no more than 2 or 3 times a year, and never order the french fries. I exercise as much as I am able, though several cumulative injuries have made this much harder in recent years. I am almost always hungry. And yet I am slowly gaining weight. I now weigh near 200 lbs., most of it around my middle.

When I was younger, I took great pride in staying slimmer than my sisters, although it cost me a great deal of comfort (it is hard being hungry and always saying no to dessert). I believed it was simply a matter of will. Now that my genetic type has asserted itself, the only additional thing I have had to eat was my pride.

I hear tremendous pride in your attitudes about others' weight. If you are a naturally slender person, that is a gift that you should be grateful for, not proud of. I doubt very much that you eat as little or as carefully as I do.

jessejo — Fri Aug. 8th 10:16p.m.

The Fat Acceptance Movement is understandable to me at a personal level, yet troubling from a societal and public health standpoint.

People should not be stereotyped based upon their appearence or physical characteristics. Ostracizing and ridiculing individual people is not going to make either them or our culture healthier.

That said, there is overwhelming medical evidence that, all other things being equal, being overweight makes us less healthy. Overweight people have higher rates of many diseases; they spend more on health care over a given period of time than non-overweight people; they die younger.

Fat Acceptance is fine to the extent it means that fat people should be respected, valued, evaluated and held responsible exactly like people who aren't fat. I have a real problem with it, though, to the extent that the movement attempts to obscure the medical facts concerning the health consequences of being overweight.

Morrolan — Wed Aug. 6th 4:39p.m.

Has it occurred to you that the "medical facts" are the things that are being manipulated to continue to make us all think we are sick and need to be fixed. 30 billion dollars a year are spent on pills and "cures". There is big money to be lost if we start to think for a minute that maybe we are okay.

Consider these words from Paul Campos: ...."Americans are enjoying longer lives and better health than ever before, the claim that four out of five of us are running serious health risks because of our weight sounds exactly like the sort of exaggeration that can produce a cultural epidemic of fear, bearing no relation to any rational assessment of risk. "

See article here: http://www.mamashealth.com/book/omyth.asp

fatandfine — Wed Aug. 6th 5:03p.m.

The fact that some people may have incentives to exaggerate the risks associated with a thing is not evidence that those risks do not exist.

If you are seriously saying that there are NO health risks associated with being overweight, I point you to: the Mayo Clinic [url]http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/obesity/DS00314/DSECTION=complications[/url], Harvard Medical School [url]http://hms.harvard.edu/public/disease/obesity/[/url], Stanford Medical School [url]http://healthlibrary.stanford.edu/resources/internet/bodysystems/nutrition_obesity.html[/url], etc.

Even the article you quote is not saying the risks do not exist:
[quote]This book does not argue that there is no relationship between weight and health. It argues, rather, that the health risks associated with higher-than-average weight have been greatly exaggerated, while all sorts of related but far graver risks have been ignored. In particular, this book emphasizes that poverty, poor nutrition, and a culture that makes it easy for Americans to be sedentary are important public health issues in America today. We should be encouraging Americans to be physically active, to eat well, and to provide reasonable access to medical care for those among us who lack it.[/quote]
All of that is easy to agree with and does not support an argument that being overweight carries no health risks.

Morrolan — Wed Aug. 6th 5:27p.m.

I never said there are not risks for being fat. But, I am saying that they are overstated and overblown for the sake of the ama's pockets and that the medical studies we see on the evening news are often funded by drug companies.

Of course you can be overweight and unhealthy and yes, it is harder to get good exercise when you are big. But, you can be thin and unhealthy, too. Yet, most people look at a fat person and assume many many things about them, including that they are unhealthy.

fatandfine — Wed Aug. 6th 7:58p.m.

There has been no study to show that losing weight will increase health, yet many studies which has shown that yo-yo dieting is very unhealthy. Considering up to 98% of diets fail, yo-yo dieting is what most Americans have been forced into. There are reasons these diets do not work. I think it is good for people of all sizes to try to live a healthy lifestyle, but that does not mean weight loss. At my healthiest I was biking over 15 miles a day and other activities, and I have been eating a relatively healthy vegan diet for over 12 years. I have always been fat and did not lose any weight no matter how fit I was. That's the thing though, I was fit and fat. If I tried to lose weight, it would have compromised my health.

There are always health concerns for people to have. This is not due to your body size, but other factors such as your blood pressure, cholesterol, energy and more. These are things that every body size should watch for. In fact, studies have actually shown there are more health risks with being underweight than overweight or obese. There are reasons this is not discussed as much, since being underweight is something our culture encourages.

The truth is, regardless of a person's size or health, the obsession with weight is hurting everyone's health. Women especially are growing up learning to hate their bodies and this hurts everyone. Hiding behind hating fat because of health is not the whole truth. Regardless of how much medical costs are "associated" with being overweight, the cost to the younger generation is something we can never recover. We need to be promoting respect for every person and health at every size. Children need to grow up loving their bodies no matter what, not creating a culture of judgement.

ChelseaK — Wed Aug. 6th 6:40p.m.

Just heard your question on the radio 'what's daily life like at almost 400lbs?' My day is probably like anybody else's, thanks for asking. Everybody has stuff they have to deal with, what I deal with is just visually apparent to all of you. What I would like to say is that at almost 400lbs (390 to be exact) I did my first sprint distance triathlon 2 years ago. I also did my second at about that weight, and my third at 370 a year later. I'll swim across the Columbia next month for, I think, the 4th time. If you think you know everything you need to know about fat people and their lives based on what we look like, you don't. And, by the way, I am fat, I am not sick and I spent 3 weeks in Thailand this year so I guess the world is accessible to me. You do what you want to do with your life, whether that is sit on your ass feeling sorry for yourself at 125lbs or 400lbs, or go out and do your best with what you've got.

ssbbwathlete — Wed Aug. 6th 8:44p.m.

My sister and her fianc� are both obese. He is about 400 lbs. They are in their early 30's, and otherwise healthy and active. They work together, and last week he was late, but hadn't called in. After 20 minutes, she called me in a panic, and said "this isn't like him. What if he had a heart attack or something?"
I find it interesting that she would jump to this conclusion about his health, but she disregards anyone elses concerns for her health, saying "I go to the doctor regularly, and my blood pressure is fine". At 100+ pounds overweight, her risk is equal to his.
FYI-he is fine...it was a flat tire and dead cell phone battery that made him late and unreachable.

bcwpdx — Thu Aug. 7th 12:16p.m.

My husband and I are both overweight. I am 250 lbs and he is 365 lbs. We are very happy together and healthy despite our weight. However being overweight is inconvenient and can be expensive. We can only shop at specialty clothing stores and he has to buy extra wide shoes. When going to the movies, we go early to get an aisle seat. Flying on an airplane is uncomfortable and we rarely sit next to each other. Though we are happy people, life would be easier if we were smaller.

People who are overweight are often misjudged for their appearance. As I mentioned my husband is big and he also has many tattoos. He is not a violent man but his physical appearance intimidates people. Recently he has had trouble at work because he intimidates his boss who is shorter and thinner. His boss in return is more aggressive with my husband than with other employees he is not physically intimidated by.

It is not easy being big but it is important to love yourself and maintain your self-esteem no matter what.

Susie323 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:11p.m.

I think that it is obviously very unfair to put all obese people in the same boat - because if you did the boat would sink !

Fred McPhaidin — Thu Aug. 7th 12:11p.m.

Fred,

What is it about obesity, do you think, that gives many folks the license to make jokes? Fat jokes seem prevalent -- and public -- in a way that ethnic jokes, say, just aren't any more.

David Miller — Thu Aug. 7th 12:26p.m.

Things like ethnicity, gender, sexuality and race are not within the control of people, not to mention the fact that these things are not negative. There aren't negative health risks and debilitating effects from these things.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 12:30p.m.

If you have to watch yourself doing 'laps' - that's fine it's just not fair to make the rest of us watch as well

Fred McPhaidin — Thu Aug. 7th 12:33p.m.

why is this conversation so one sided. Why should we accept obesity as a positive thing why shouldn't obesity and being fat have a negative connotation?

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 12:26p.m.

Why is it so important to you that it is not okay. I mean really if you are not fat why does it even matter to you? It seems you really want people to hate themselves for being fat. It seems you want to label all fat people the same and judge them. Why is this important to you to do?

If there were more acceptance of fat people and less judgment, I am sure there would actually be less fat people. Yes, people who are depressed and shameful are more likely to over eat and not exercise. So, if you really want to have an effect on the number of fat people out there, change your attitude and help other people do the same.

fatandfine — Thu Aug. 7th 1:38p.m.

I am a bit disturbed by the hesitance or resistance to the label ?obese.? The guests on the show say they prefer the label ?fat? as it does not imply a medical problem. However, being significantly overweight is a health problem. Obesity is the #1 cause of preventable cardiovascular disease, can contribute to kidney failure, diabetes, and a host of other pathologies. Though it is not a ?disease? I believe that overweight people should acknowledge the health risk.

jhardwi2 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:30p.m.

Actually no, obesity in and of itself is not a health problem. It's a factor. There are many other factors involved to determine whether a person is healthy or not but everyone fixates on the fat.

cpadian — Wed Dec. 31st 1:54p.m.

When I got married 10 years ago, I was a size 5. My to be motherinlaw said to my fiancee, "look at her mother--that's what she'll look like later on." well, I am starting to look like my fat lovable mother. I am now 50+ pounds heavier (a size 12) and my inlaws treat me like a 2nd class citizen and are constantly telling me about weight loss ideas and the like. very hurtful. my best friend is 350 pounds, very successful as a therapist, happily married, with 2 beautiful kids. Being discriminated against fat people is allowed in our society and it shouldn't be.

rochellemontana — Thu Aug. 7th 12:32p.m.

Why did you become larger? Are their qualities of marriage that makes one or both mates gain weight?

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:48p.m.

How does your husband feel about your weight gain? Size 5 to 12 is a significant gain.

echolynch — Thu Aug. 7th 2:09p.m.

I lived in Germany for 15 years serving with the U.S. Army. Whenever I saw a person there who was very overweight, he or she most often turned out to be an American. I think there is something in our American diet and lifestyle that accounts for this, otherwise I would have observed the same proportion of vastly overweight people as we have in America. Most Germans walk far more regularly than we do to maintain their weight, and they eat far less fast food than we do. Also, for better or worse, there is also intense social pressure not to be too different in German society, including not being too heavy. In the USA, we are different in all of these areas.

Melodeon — Thu Aug. 7th 12:33p.m.

Have you seen Super Size Me? Amazing film. American food is too processed with too much fat, salt and chemicals. Left my sedentary job and went to New Zealand to get some much needed exercise. Got more than I bargained for. Lost about 50 pounds and didn't know it. Even though I felt starved and I was eye-balling my mates as cuisine options, I loved that the food we ate wasn't processed. We had to cut and peel our potatoes, some of which had bugs. For a month I had a much healthier life style and much better quality food.

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:54p.m.

I was going to post something here about my personal experiences related to being fat. What I've experienced in my life, how I am eating a 1400 calorie a day diet, working out 5 times a week and am still fat. But there's so much hate in the posts to this page that I feel uncomfortable sharing my story. This isn't about trying to understand what a fat or "obese" person goes through. It's just another forum for people to blame, name call, and ignore fat people. Wow, so refreshing. No one's ever told me I was unhealthy because of my weight! Thanks OPB.

vivian — Thu Aug. 7th 12:36p.m.

Yes, I am surprised at how incredibly rude some of the people are who are posting here.

Didn't their mommies and daddies teach them any manners?

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 12:54p.m.

You guys should really stop feeling so sorry for yourself. People are honest not rude and if you can't take honesty then you would just prefer to live in a world where everyone is happy the way they are. Jens Voigt of team CSC said it best when he said "People who are content with the way they are will never improve. People who think they have worked hard enough are bound to lose." I don't think he meant weight

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 1:24p.m.

I don't feel sorry for myself, I feel sorry for you for being so rude and for your lack of manners. I pity you.

Oh, and you seem to include me in the category of fat and/or obese people without knowing anything about me. I am neither, I just find your rudeness offensive.

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 1:32p.m.

arsmorriende:
Why exactly are you so fervently lopsided about this subject? You seem to think fat people are getting some-kind of blame-free ride? Are you just making sure they are held accountable? Should we hold you accountable for being intellectually sloppy, subjective and irrational? You should have tried harder at school. You should study more. If you only tried you could be smarter. Lazy.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:49p.m.

That would be a really good point if I didn't have an full academic scholarship to the U of O. Maybe I am a bit lazy in my post and they are sloppy but don't think that they are withut thought. My point is that people shouldn't just get used and to and become happy with terrible life styles because they are unwilling to change their lifestyle. How is it irrational to say if you eat too many calories others won't have as many calories to eat and that this is what leads to being overweight.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 4p.m.

Still is a good point---G. Bush went to college too. College Scholarship or GED, neither are accurate gauges of intelligence.
And U of O? Really not the best school in the nation. So all this is yes, relative. It was also sarcasm, but back to the subject...

So your point was then "to say if you eat too many calories others won't have as many calories to eat and that this is what leads to being overweight." I think you have said much more on this blog. Clearly your motivation is not to state the obvious, that extra calories lead to weight gain. I think everyone can agree on that. You were placing blame and passing judgement over and over. And, not just about an individual but an entire group of people.

I agree that being fat is a problem, medically and perhaps otherwise. It shouldn't just be "we love you the way you are." But it also shouldn't be about blame and ridicule. It is a complex issue, that apparently afflicts many in our modern culture, and its cause isn't just arbitrary sloppiness and lack of control. This war against fat people seems to have taken the irreverent tone of the religious on the war against loose morals.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 5:36p.m.

A war against fat people, no no really its a war against a sense of entitlement.I can eat as much as I want despite what it means for the rest of the world and you should respect me despite the fact that I have never done anything to deserve it. Your crispy moderate liberal mind can't probably wrap your head around earning respect. Why would I want anyone of your respect I haven't done anything that you know about to earn it. I don't feel that I deserve respect irrespective of what i do. You really don't know me and judging by your posts I would never want to. I know you guys don't like me and thats fine because you guys only like people who are barney-like figures that say only what you want to hear. No honesty just arm distance inuendo as to what all the skinny people are thinking: People who feel entitled to repect and whatever else no matter how it effects others disgust me. We need some hugs though even stupid people like me.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 9:02p.m.

Dear Arsmorriende,

I think that's an interesting perspective to see fat people as entitled. In fact one, I can't wrap my head around. What is so entitled about being ridiculed constantly by someone who knows nothing about you? I'm not taking food out or your mouth. We are blessed in the country with an abundance of food. So I'm not sure how this impacts you? I've heard the medical costs arguments, but really are fat people just a scapegoat? No where are we talking about our broken health care system.

Being fat and happy aren't mutually exclusive. I can want to loose weight, or not. I can be a depressed person or a happy person. I can be active and follow a diet and exercise plan my doctor wants for me and still be fat. These pages are filled with similar statements. Why can't you take that for face value? No one's asking of pity, not even respect from you. I was asked a question on air today and spent a few minutes answering it. You, as far as I can tell came on just to make fun of people. I feel sorry for you that you have to make yourself feel better by hurting perfect strangers. Good luck and I hope your self esteem shores up!

vivian — Fri Aug. 8th 2:05a.m.

The unfortunate thing about being fat or obese---is that it is an easy target. It is an easy way to look at someone and make the assumption correctly or incorrectly that this person has little mental control. I do think much of obesity is related to mental health and control, but, and a big BUT there are many other equally unfortunate mental conditions which skinny people walk around with freely that don't manifest themselves in the physical---they go around unnoticed. So being fat is an easy target, an overused target---and fat people are often the scapegoat for everything we hate about ourselves.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 12:37p.m.

Really good post, Scott.

Vivian, I think there are mostly valuable comments here today. We just need to overlook the few, sad, individuals who posted rude comments.

My whole life, I have been told I?m over-weight. I grew up in a family setting where my mom and dad constantly ridiculed fat/obese people (behind their backs, of course). ?Look at that guy?bet he?s never missed a meal..?. They constantly suggested diets for me and they were always on them.

The reality was that I was never over a reasonable weight for my height/body-type. At 35 I was 6? 2?, 210 lbs., and I?d be getting ?Reader?s Digest? diet tips in the mail from my mom?

At 50, I look back now at photos of me at 35, and I want to jump in a time-machine, return to the past, and straighten my folks out.

Pacific Land — Thu Aug. 7th 12:56p.m.

Good point.

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 1:02p.m.

I look at all of those behaviors as just as harmful and feel the same way about people that exhibit these behaviors that are obese. People who drink are basically poisoning themselves, congratulations you have successfully compared yourself to alcoholics. That is a GOOD comparison.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 12:38p.m.

Right, and overconsumption of food is definitely an unhealthy behavior. I don't think anyone can deny that. The problem is that you can't assume that fat people are simply overconsumers. There are many ways to become fat and they don't all involve cheetos.

But let's suspend reality and say for a second that the only way someone can become fat is to eat too much food. You seem to have this misconception that somewhere, fat and soon-to-be fat people are sitting around stuffing their faces, craftily thinking "ha HA! I can eat as much as I want! Screw everyone else!" when in fact, people with eating disorders (which is what overeating is) are in pain, feel terrible, and want nothing more than to stop the disordered eating and feel normal again.

Fat people are PEOPLE. They have the same hopes and desires as skinny people. They have the same cares and dreams and goals and thought processes as skinny people. It seems to me that you see fat people as caricatures who are selfish and just want to consume everything, therefore it is clear that you take everything the media says at face value. How about a little critical thinking? Do you not know even one fat person who doesn't fit the stereotype? Really?

cpadian — Wed Dec. 31st 2:15p.m.

Ok I recently had a aha moment, I recently stopped eating meat and consequently lost 30 lbs. I didn't even realize that I had been gaining weight. I weighed more than I did through my pregnancies.

I now feel great and when I look at pic.I can't believe the difference. I am now very mindful of my weight. It has changed my blood pressure, so i do believe that being over weight is a health problem, and a drain on our health care in general.

Shannon

thompson.shannon13 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:39p.m.

I'm 5'10" 220lbs. I'm fat. I'm a size 16. I'm not really that big. Even when I managed to get down to 175 I was still a size 14, that's just my size. I run around after my 30 month old and eat small portions of healthy foods. I weighed more in high school. Weight, for me, is not something that I can magically go "poof" and make it go away. When I lost 65 lbs the first semester of my freshman year I injured my ankle and was on crutches on a large campus and was too tired to eat more than one meal a day. That was how I lost weight. I'm a nursing mother, I can't do that. My mother, who is my height and used to weigh almost 400 lbs, has recently lost a lot of weight my strictly controlling carbs on a diabetic diet as she was diagnosed type II. That's great for her, but now she rubs this in my face, making me feel bad that I weigh more than she does. I know she's proud of her accomplishment, but she hurts my feelings about my inability to lose weight.

oboeduckie — Thu Aug. 7th 12:40p.m.

The argument that obesity is healthy is completely off-base. True, after certain traumatic procedures, such as heart attack the overweight fair better. However, the undisputable fact is that obesity is the #1 cause of preventable cardiovascular disease, thereby increasing the chance of heart attack. I feel as if the guests on the show are completely denying the fact that obesity does increase one?s risk for disease (cardiovascular, diabetes, renal disease, joint problems). I don?t believe that overweight people are making a conscious decision to be fat, but they should acknowledge the involved health risk.

jhardwi2 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:40p.m.

Today's show on obesitiy is not an easy topic, to discuss as a guest (I applaud those who stepped forward as guests) or to approach as the producing show. As for the latter, be aware that some of the earlier questions posed . . . for instance, about whether fat or obese is the preferred term . . . do not serve the interests of overweight people, but rather reinforce stereotyping. The latter subjects, about life experiences as an overweight person, and society's adaptation to, or exclusion of, those who do not fit the "normal" body patterns, are more insightful.

lifegrabit — Thu Aug. 7th 12:44p.m.

I have taken many trips to Central America with a friend who is very overweight. People in most of the cultures there have no problem telling her she's fat. One person even commented that it was okay that she was so fat because she's not ugly. People have also expressed their health concerns for her. What makes it different than in the US is that it's just a comment - similar to saying someone has red hair or green eyes. The intent behind the observation is entirely different than it would be if these things were said in the US. I've found that the Latin American culture, in general, is much more accepting of people how they are and, at least from my travels, they seem to have fewer problems with obesity. Could it be that the pressure to be thin, makes people fatter?

Morgan M — Thu Aug. 7th 12:45p.m.

Bloody. I am 36 years old, I weigh - well in April I weighed 330lbs. I'm 6' and I was told 10 years ago or so that an ideal weight for me is about 210lbs, not 170 as well - I'd look like a lollipop if I weighed that much.

The toughest thing for me is that I am a woman and I am obese, and I do face discrimination pretty much every week. I have two children, a toddler and a preschooler, and for exercise I push the 90lbs (they're 4' and over 36" each, good BMI for those boys) or so of them in a stroller for 3.6 miles every other day. We walk for half an hour at 4 miles an hour, they play on the playground for 1/2 an hour, and then I complete my walk for the next 1.6 miles. During my walks I get a lot of stares, if there are teenagers there are typically slurs thrown out such as "fat ass" "tub of lard". I've gotten this since high school, when I was not obese merely overweight. Then my favorite was being called a transvestite, but one afternoon walking downtown with my friend we came around a corner and a fellow said "You're too fat to fuck!" Right, and I'd want to with you because?

Everyone of us use the people around us as a mirror to judge how we are doing socially and morally. My mirror tells me I am worthless and less then human, so I have to be careful to keep in mind my mirror is a fun house mirror and is skewed by prejudice and other's self hatred. But going without that mirror is hard too, since without an idea of where you are you become untethered and without a landscape to direct you in the right direction. To ignore those around you and their perceptions of you is scary and courageous, and it's quite lonely. Yes I am quite fat, but I am also a scholar, a mother, a wife, a daughter, and I bet if you knew me you would be surprised at how wonderful I really am.

C.Duehn — Thu Aug. 7th 12:48p.m.

I'll admit it: I'm am a bit of a fat-a-phobe.

I think my assumptions about fat/obese/overweight people are subconscious and automatic. I assume they have no self control, little self respect, low self esteem, and cannot possibly be truly happy. These are all unattractive characteristics to me, and though they inspire empathy, they do not inspire socialization with the individual. Maybe I need to try to change my subconscious assumptions, and I've tried, but it seems most fat people I connect with actually DO display the characteristics I assume to be true.

Don't get me wrong. I don't call people names or curl my lip or anything. I respect the humanity of all people, regardless of race or weight or gender. It's just that these assumptions exist in my head, and certainly color my interaction (or lack thereof) with obese strangers.

There have been times in my life when I have been heavier than I'd like, which for me is around 160 lbs (I'm 5'8"), but I always look at myself at that point, and think, "I need to make some changes." I take responsibility for my weight and my health. I don't make excuses, and I don't continue destroying my body. We all find ourselves out of control from time to time, but personal responsibility is key. I have a friend who is definitely overweight. She just made the choice to take responsibility. She works hard to lose weight, and has made a plan to keep it off. She is not making excuses, and so far she's lost 18 lbs. I respect that.

Finally, I find it amusing and a bit absurd that Americans are so wealthy that we can first of all AFFORD to get so fat, and then spend MORE money on diets and gym memberships to reverse the fruits of our excesses. Considering 90% of the people on this planet would never have the resources to get fat in the first place...

plateauphoto — Thu Aug. 7th 12:49p.m.

Actually, I think as someone mentioned earlier there are a lot of economics at play when we make our food choices. I read in the Omnivore's Dilemma (I think or Michael Pollen's newest book) that a bag of potato chips is cheaper per calorie then carrots. When your poor, your instinct is to get more calories for your buck. I know it costs me a lot more money to eat fresh, organic food then it does to eat processed hi-fat, hi-calorie food. I work at shelter and all the food we get from the Food Bank is often not the healthiest. Being educated about healthy food is a luxury. Please note that I am not saying all poor people are fat or that rich fat people aren't responsible for their food choices. Just that many people learn what's "healthy" by reading advertisement on boxes.

vivian — Thu Aug. 7th 12:58p.m.

I gained some weight as a result of smoking cigarettes years ago. When I quit cold turkey, I was 180 pounds. To help me quit I started running and riding my bike to keep me moving. I did this because I typically smoked when I was relaxing at home. I also did not change my eating habits at all. In spite of normal diet and extra exercise I still gained 60 pounds. Since quitting it seems like my weight has stabilized but I can't seem to lose the extra pounds. My dad who shares my same body type had the same thing happen to him. He eventually fell off the wagon and has started smoking again. As a smoker he was bragging about losing weight and being 180 lbs again. To me the choice seems like a choice between smoker or overweight. So i find it frustrating. Its not always a matter of exercise and diet and I think people don't really understand that.

sampdx — Thu Aug. 7th 12:51p.m.

Going to work this morning, and reading and hearing all these comments on the show, I can say as a member of the medical research field, that the effect that obesity has on this country, just economically alone, is costing this country millions. All people deserve to be treated with respect, but rationalizing a medical condition in order to "feel good" about yourself is ridiculous and irresponsible.

In the hospital alone, ask any doctor or medical staff, and they can attest to the ravages that obesity has on the human body. There is not one biological system that is affected by chronic obesity, and whether you "feel" healthy or not, doesn't make you healthy, ask any medical professional. I believe in treating everybody with compassion and care, but rationalizing this behavior puts the average layperson at great medical risk.

I had a college apartment mate who was fat, about 300 lbs. and 5'8. Even though he "felt" healthy, his fatty liver, diagnosed by his doctor painted a grim picture. He asked me for help, and I was more than happy to oblige. In three months, on a healthy diet, and 2 hours of exercise a day, including 1 hour of aerobic exercise, he lost 90 lbs in a span of 3 months, but more importantly regained liver function, 100%.

Bottom line? Respect everybody and each other, but be realistic about your body and your health.

jaydee83 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:51p.m.

I agree, 100%. "Feeling healthy" when you are quite obviously obese is merely self-delusion. Being realistic and taking personal responsibility are the only ways to begin to solve the problem.

plateauphoto — Thu Aug. 7th 12:56p.m.

I am a nurse working in a hospital. I love diversity and believe everyone has the right to good self-esteem. I wish that for everyone. But I feel like the person forgotten in the argument of whether weight negatively impacts a person's health outcome is the healthcare worker that a heavy person will expect to help them move when they need help: the nurses lifting, turning and helping them to the bathroom; the paramedics extracting them from where they have fallen or had a wreck or become unconscious, etc... I know we are negatively affected by that other person's obesity in a big way. As time goes on I find myself more begrudging of that person's choice to maintain a body that they are at times unable to lift, and then look at me to do what they can't. Overweight hurts: joints, backs, my hands from lifting. I live that in my job.

Kat the Nurse — Thu Aug. 7th 12:54p.m.

An excellent point, Kat.
There are two nurses in my family who have suffered back injuries as a result of assisting these larger individuals.

Regarding your comment about overweight hurts. It's true. I will never forget the day I was watching television w/her when a prescription med ad (which I think should NOT be on TV as we have Americans self-diagnosing themselves) came on for foot pain. Naturally, my mother has problems w/her feet hurting because of all the extra weight she is carrying. She said "Hey, I should talk to the doctor about that medication."

No, you are just carrying more weight than your joints + feet can support.

Treat the problem. Not the symptom.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 12:59p.m.

If you are a nurse you really shouldn't be making those kind of assumptions about why someone may or may not be fat. Certainly tall people and muscular people weigh more! Oh and those expecting mothers, with that extra weight, they are really selfish. Oh and those conjoined twins they are a real bitch to flip!!!

PS. I have a healthy BMI, no need to worry about me.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:17p.m.

I have a mother who was diagnosed w/Type II diabetes almost 8 years ago as a result of being fat, overweight, obese....take your pick of words for whatever makes you most comfortable. I thought this would be a "reality check" for her + provide some motivation to get her to re-evaluate + change her lifestyle.

Note: LIFESTYLE.

A couple of things that I keep reading in several posts is: "I diet....None have worked....I work out...." I am not certain of everyone's exact circumstance, but I know in the case of my mother (+ thereby it's just a matter of statistics that it applies to others) she runs w/whatever the next fad diet is for a few weeks, or maybe a few months + "woe is me" if she has not had success.

Note: It doesn't take very long to put ON the weight, but it takes MUCH longer to lose it. Even if you're not severely overweight. And when you are severely overweight it makes it much hard to be mobile + do some of the exercises that yield better results of weight loss.

That is why it is a LIFESTYLE change. Changing your eating habits. Your outlook on life. Your ability to set goals + stick to them. Fad diets don't work. And that's why there is the statistic that 95% of the people who diet + lose weight gain it back (as was mentioned in an earlier post).

STOP thinking DIET. START thinking HEALTHY LIVING.
ie. NO fast food.

Now, it is my belief that the government has some responsibility in the current obesity crisis facing our country. A number of mass-produced foods, etc. that make up the bulk of the "meals" in this country are loaded w/high-fructose corn syrups, preservatives + a host of other ingredients that contribute to poor health, low energy levels + a dependency on these "fat foods". They have also catered to large corporations like Kraft Foods, for example (or should I say Morris....as in cigarettes that is now their parent company) making all these non-nutritious foods the staple in the American diet.

And, how has genetically modified foods not made it's way into this conversation.....?

Lastly, there are people out there who genetically have propensities towards being overweight + cannot lose weight on their own. Unfortunately, I think that becomes an excuse or a scapegoat for many who make poor lifestyle decisions.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 12:54p.m.

I believe there was some research done on the genetics of obesity, and it showed that it was responsible for less than 5%.

jaydee83 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:59p.m.

Exactly.
And if I were part of THAT 5%, I would be upset w/all the people who are overweight due to poor lifestyle choices.
They are overweight for reasons that cannot be helped + are lumped in w/all those who can.
Unfortunate.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:01p.m.

Permanent weight loss is not about eating less and exercising more, it's about building a healthy relationship with food. It's about not turning to food for love, turning to food when your sad, lonely, or don't want to deal with your emotions, etc... Diets don't work because diets generally focus on calories and exercise. Diets should focus on positive mental health, helping people explore the reasons they turn to food for support and how to love yourself (including your body) unconditionally.

amajekob — Thu Aug. 7th 12:58p.m.

YES!
Very well put.

Also, let's think about the KINDS of food that the majority of Americans eat.
Things from boxes. Frozen packages. Preserved mystery things.
We've lost the REAL connection w/food. FRESH food.

I seem to recall a study that was done about the high-fat content of the French diet.
But why they don't seem to have as many problems w/overweight citizens.
If my memory serves me correctly, it had something to do w/how they interact w/food.
The fresh ingredients used. The positivity around food. Social gatherings. etc

Many Americans come home, through a pot of boiling water on, rip open that boxed food, dump, repeat.
Many don't COOK. They REHEAT.
I grew up thinking I knew what it was to cook. Sadly, I was groomed to reheat.

And I am thankful, that I now live in a part of the country that has a strong focus on farmer's markets, fresh produce, local foods, sustainability. It all goes hand-in-hand.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:06p.m.

"I seem to recall a study that was done about the high-fat content of the French diet."

I think that they eat small portions of many different foods so that any one fat dish is very small unlike the American tendency to eat very large portions of fatty foods and not much variety. A generalization, French eat for taste, Americans eat for volume, to get full.

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 1:41p.m.

I grew up an insecure fat kid. I was teased because I was fat. my clothes were "husky". As I entered my teens, I was still fat, but my self confidence had improved so it wasn't as bad. I ate junk food and didn't exercise as did all of my friends (some thin, some fat). I wore a size 14. Somewhere between high school and college I started eating better and exercising, but I didn't know that's what I was doing. I had a different set of friends and that's what they did. I managed to shrink down to a size 8. That was roughly 20 years ago. Over the past 20 years I managed to pack on close to 100 pounds. I have never lost my self esteem, despite some of my partners' best efforts, lol. My theory was "If you don't want to see my fat body in a bikini, don't look at me." it really was that simple. Until my size 16 trousers started to get uncomfortably tight and my vanity prevented me from buying a bigger size. I joined a weight loss program and started exercising again. I have shed over 50 pounds since September of last year. I'm heavier than I was in high school, but I am able to comfortably wear a size 8. I knew I had weight to lose, but had no clue I had 50 pounds to spare. I feel better than I have ever felt in my life.
Losing weight and learning how to eat sensible portions, fresh foods, and to exercise is the best thing I've ever done for myself. However, I do not have the right to tell others they have to do so as well. Everyone must come to their own conclusion about their own bodies.

aymes35 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:58p.m.

Congratulations!
I think you bring up a very good point.
As in all situations,
you have to want to help yourself first.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:08p.m.

I'm an insurance claims rep. and I wanted to go back to what was said earlier with the Dr. visits. Lets look at a person that is around 150# that drinks, smokes etc...then look at a person that is 400# and does the same thing. We see more claims for insurance for the larger person then the smaller. I understand that if your working out and staying healthy however, the folks that are bigger and do have bad habbits they will go to the dr office more often then the people that do not have so much wieght.

oregon606 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:58p.m.

Exactly.
I'm glad you caught that too.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:09p.m.

Fat, obese, overweight, large boned, chubby, cherubic, Rubinesque - who cares about the term used if when we don't address the associated issues? How come so many Americans are unhealthfully large? Do they work in stressful, unsatisfying jobs? Do they eat too much processed food? Are they too sedentary? Do they lack self esteem from growing up in a society where compassion and concern for others takes second place to climbing the ladder in tunnel-visioned pursuit of the "American Dream"?

trurl9 — Thu Aug. 7th 12:58p.m.

I believe the answer is "Yes".
To all of it.
Unfortunately, the American way of life
supports + encourages
their depression, lack of self-esteem + motivation, unhealthy food, etc.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:19p.m.

I honestly don?t care about making obese people feel comfortable by using words they like. I am Asian, and yes I have been called names (by obese people and skinny people, but always white) so I can relate and understand. But obese is a medical term and these people on your show are in fact obese. I agree it can be difficult for obese people in society, but obesity isn?t gender, or age or even race. There is a degree of control that say the 64 year old forced to retire before 65 might face, or the woman not being hired simply because she is female. It is a relative degree of control. Does this make discrimination against obese people acceptable? No, but sometimes it is necessary. Personally I do not like sitting next to overly obese individuals on planes, because they literally are in my seat. I am in favor of paying air fare based on weight and if the person is unable to physically fit in the seat, yes, that person should have to purchase two seats.
I also believe in fairness in medical insurance ? and treatment of conditions that are caused by or exacerbated by excess body fat should have higher co-pays than other treatments. I also believe in accident insurance and pay a higher premium for my motorcycle insurance ? so I think this is fair and equitable. Obese individuals should either pay a higher premium, or pay more out of pocket when the inevitable treatment is necessary. Someone posted on here about taking their friend to the ER five times. Guess who is paying for all five times to the ER? The heart attacks, strokes, knee surgeries, etc that come with this much weight all cost everyone.
Instead of trying to change society to have them look upon obesity and an OK thing, maybe the answer is helping those that need help maintain a healthier body weight? In the long run isn?t that better for everyone, including the obese? Since the human body isn?t built to carry that much extra weight it would be a more comfortable existence for those that are obese and help those that aren?t financially.

As the guests on the show prove, everyone of them would rather be thin or HWP than obese. If everyone that was obese was so happy being obese, would they wish their children to be even more obese?

echolynch — Thu Aug. 7th 1p.m.

I agree!
So well put.
As I was taught when younger:
We all have choices to make in life.
But be prepared for the consequences.
Positive or negative.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:13p.m.

Why do people have a constant need to tell fat people:
you are to blame,
you are just eating to much,
it is a negative condition,
it is bad for your health.
Of course all these things are true, but so what! Do we speak the same way about the depressed?
Depression is also terribly unhealthy, so is anger. Do we repeatedly blame these people for being depressed? The way we blame fat people?

Fat people are an easy target. They can't hide it. But the mental framework for being fat is hardly different from that of many other conditions we have a hard time of controlling.

Each time a new study saying being fat is unhealthy it is just more fodder for fat haters.

Being fat is sort of the new SUV in the eyes of many hipsters I know. They really do stupidly hate fat people. But being fat is not a choice anymore then being smart is, buying an SUV is indeed a choice in the true meaning of the word.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:01p.m.

Depression is a clinical condition.
In most cases, being obese is an individual decision based on life choices.
You cannot compare the two.

I agree w/you regarding anger.
But that is also in the spotlight.
ie. Road Rage.
They don't get a hall pass either.

Being fat is in the spotlight a lot right now
because the current health system crisis.
Skyrocketing costs, etc.
So, if you wonder why so many people are thinking about it,
it's because so many costs incurred are spent taking care of those who make poor decisions.
Like the guy going to the emergency room 5 times thinking he was having a heart attack @ age 20.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:17p.m.

Sorry you're wrong. There is a lot of evidence suggesting that being overweight is indeed a clinical condition. This "choice" crap is used by people over and over again, it is really uninteresting. This view is shortsighted. As if everyone fat is just greedy, likes to pig out, because it is so much fun. Yep. I love stuffing myself. I hate my body, but I sure love to eat. I don't want to be fat, yet everyone is telling me I have decided to be. You made the choice, now live with the consequences. Is this really how simple you think everything is?

I'm depressed. I know if I tried really hard, went and got some great cognitive therapy and a load of antidepressants I just might get better. But I haven't done so. So I guess I must just like being depressed, I've made the choice. Now it is all in my hands. This is the same thing as being fat. People don't just get fat because they like to eat and want ever more. There is clearly something deeper causing this desire or lack of control. It isn't some simpleton choice, like you propose anymore then anything else is.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:33p.m.

I was not, by any means, oversimplifying the situation for everyone.
As I mentioned before, there are thousands of people who cannot help their weight control due to genetics.
Perhaps you are one of these people.
I was addressing those who DO have a choice to make better lifestyle changes (ie. my own mother) + choose NOT to.

Regarding depression, I was referencing those who have clinical depression + are not overweight. People who are overweight + have depression, it is often caused because of being overweight. I know, that's my mom. She wouldn't otherwise be depressed, if it weren't for her physical condition. Squeezing into airline seats, stares, comments, name-calling, sticking herself w/a needle every day, taking dozens of pills several times a day, the fear of going blind or suffering a stroke or heart attack from the diabetes.

It's very likely that some people who are overweight have clinical depression not caused by being overweight. But there are a significant number who have depression because of it. So, in that scenario, the cause needs to be treated, not the symptom (ie. losing weight so you can start to feel better about yourself + minimize the negative impacts it has in your life). But, often times, therapy is needed to pull you out of the depression so that you have the motivation to do so.

None of this is black or white.
It's all shades of grey + every person + their situation is unique.
When we discuss these issues, myself included, we can only speak in general terms.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:52p.m.

anotheropinion:

Apparently not. No, we apparently don't always speak in general terms, you just went back and revised, and reworded, what you originally said---so it now seems grayer and more inclusive, because you realized it wasn't so black and white, fat and skinny.

Exactly what percentage do you estimate of the obese, just decided to be so, through bad "choices?"

I'm not exactly sure why you would suggest I am one of these people, it just so happens I AM NOT "one of these people." I am at a healthy weight, yep even on the good old BMI. But I do know many "of these people" and they aren't contagious.

I have also been quick to blame, to suggest "if she just stopped eating." But I realized I also do things constantly that I wish I didn't, that I could make better "choices" so often, that sometimes I am "lazy," that my life isn't a series of always doing the best things and how different is this from their experience. And, it occurred to me "fat people" are just easy targets, because they can't hide their screw-ups, they wear them around the waste for all to see. I just glide in and out of rooms with all my bad decisions and vices hidden and no one can see.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 2:33p.m.

"they aren't contagious"...

Funny story, no judgment from me, but a recent Harvard study (about 2 years ago) came out and concluded that if you are consistently around an overweight population you are more likely to become overweight. The study talks about lifestyle habits, economics and social pressures (at a restaurant we order a basket of fries to share....and so it goes). There was even a parody made based on this study in an episode of Boston Legal.

just thought your comment was funny.

amy-OR — Thu Aug. 7th 3:30p.m.

Not a gotcha with a sob story. But it is a valid case of how much can we actually blame someone and accuse them of these "choices." My best friend, was sexually abused repeatedly as a child. Grew up and struggled repeatedly with his weight and depression. He was indeed obese. Then he took his life. I hardly think he made some free will crappy choice to become obese because he liked it that way. He already had a screwed up life, so why not get fat, oh what fun!!! Then he must have killed himself because it was what he wanted, he made the choice. Yep.

What is a choice exactly? How much does it mean? Why people make choices is as important as the choices they make.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:44p.m.

Then why don't you just say there is no such thing as free will. No one has a choice about anything. We all just are slaves to genetics and our surroundings and we can't be blamed. If I kill someone its fine because no one would ever want to do that if they had a choice. NO FREE WILL NO RESPONSIBILITY good mantra.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 1:49p.m.

arsmorriende:
Your views of free will are a little vanilla. Check out some Daniel Dennett.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 2:35p.m.

This is starting a total other conversation but the way I feel about free will is more in line with that of Soren Kirkegaard. It is at once impossible to imagine free will and impossible to say that humans are anything but infinitely free and therefore RESPONSIBLE for their actions.

arsmorriende — Thu Aug. 7th 4:07p.m.

I hope that you take some Psychology courses on your way through U of O, then you will learn about psychological conditioning and hopefully gain a wider perspective of why we humans do what we do.

Or go right to B. F. Skinner for a starter on his pioneering experiments.

I think that your either/or attitude is unworthy of a U of O student.

Tom D Ford — Thu Aug. 7th 8:11p.m.

A tough situation, true.
One thing to remember is the difference between REASONS + EXCUSES.
He had a REASON for what led him down the path to obesity.
And a very sad + unfortunate one @ that.
But he made EXCUSES for why letting himself become overweight was okay.
Unfortunately, there are thousands of people who are sexually or physically victimized in their lives (I was), but don't let that stand in their way of leading a happy, healthy life + making POSITIVE life choices.
It's difficult.
But it's your decision to make.
So, yes, it is a choice.
In his case, a tough one.
But he still had a choice.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:56p.m.

anotheropinion:

Oh okay. Yes that's really some lovely and sophisticated insight. Actually he didn't make excuses, just so the record is straight, he didn't even admit or have the introspection to figure this could be part of the problem. I am making the "excuse" for him. After the fact---to say gee you don't know every-one's past, their personality traits, combined with their genetics and personal history to know that someone truly has some Utopian choice and the mental ability to decide to get skinny.

I'm glad you are real American trooper and you made the most of your terrible abuse. You are a real saint. A real Oprah story. Oh you overcame. And everyone else can to. If they just try hard enough!!! You are clearly better then they. May the force be with you in all your days.

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 2:09p.m.

anotheropinion, and also, to anyone else who is so sure that it's all about choices and excuses and whatever else you have come up with to moralize at fat people:

I find it interesting that you all speak of reasons vs excuses, the idea of being fat as "okay" or "not okay", and I have to ask myself, Who appointed you the guardians of the human condition? I am fat, but I don't share your obvious viewpoint that I don't deserve to fully participate in society or in my own life unless I am thin. I have so much else going on in my life that I rarely take the time to entertain arguments like this one, but I do find your moralizing quite interesting. Why do you think I need to make excuses for my body? It serves me well; I walk, I ride my bike, I run, I play, I have an active romantic life, an active social life, and active religious life, a successful career, a college education, and a happy family. My body is the vessel for all of that, and I love it, all 300lbs of it. I don't feel the need to justify my body to anyone, and those of you who assume I make excuses for my size are assuming that I ought to. I don't see the need. Making excuses implies that someone else has the power to excuse you. I don't see where I am accountable to anyone else for the shape or condition of my body, especially when the shape has so very little to do with the condition.

I also know that there are those out there who don't love their fat bodies. I ache for those people. You all talk about making positive choices which will lead to loving one's body, but I know from a long, hard journey of coming to love myself that it DOES NOT work that way. You have to love your body FIRST, and treating it well follows. That means loving it exactly how it is and wanting to treat it to exercise and nutritious food. Weight loss may be at best a side effect. Do you want to know why 95 - 98% of dieters fail? It's because they are focused on the wrong thing. They are focused on the result that they have very little control over, not on the process itself. For example, two dieters weighing the exact same amount may consume the exact same number of calories and do the exact same amount of exercise and lose very different amounts of weight. It happens in clinical studies all the time, which is why I know that calories in, calories out is far too simplistic a formula to be of any real value. The dieter who loses little to no weight on the plan will feel, or indeed be labeled, unsuccessful, because of a failure to lose weight, whereas the dieter who loses weight with the identical effort will be labeled a success. If, however, those dieters were instead focused on the process, by eating the healthy diet and achieving the healthy amount of exercise prescribed in the diet, both dieters would be labeled successful. It is far easier to continue a successful behavior than a failed one; if dieters would focus on the health benefits of eating well and exercising, REGARDLESS OF WEIGHT CHANGES, then that 95 to 98% statistic would disappear. Furthermore, if as a society we shifted the focus from weight to habits, then all of the thin people out there who put off worrying about their exercise needs and eating habits under the delusion that they don't need to concern themselves with it until they start gaining weight (many of whom never will) would finally get the message, which is this:

1. EVERYONE needs to eat healthy and exercise, regardless of size.
2. Size is not an indicator of health, HABITS are an indicator of health.
3. Thin people are not immune to any of the so-called weight related disorders. This is because they are not weight related, they are lifestyle related, and it happens that the lifestyle corresponds with fatter people because fat is a SIDE EFFECT of the lifestyle that CAUSES the problems. Do you get that? That's the difference between saying that no matter what I do, until I weigh 125 lbs I am doomed to die from a diabetic, arthritic, cancerous, sleep apnea-induced heart attack, and saying that as soon as I create a routine of exercising and eating healthy, I will avert most or all of my risks. The inverse of that is, just because the SYMPTOM of fatness is not present does not mean that your unhealthy habits of avoiding exercise and eating nothing but pizza and Pepsi are not endangering your health. Thin people get high cholesterol too, for example (cholesterol is essentially a hormone, FYI, and having high levels of it has little to do with the fat safely locked in their storage cells in the human body, and far more to do with the foods you take in, or your genetic disposition to produce higher levels of cholesterol. Eating cholesterol-laden pizza is bad for EVERYONE'S arteries, no matter what size person the heart resides in).
4. Research shows that it is more dangerous to be 5 lbs underweight than 80lbs overweight. It's true; being too thin is dangerous, too, moreso, in fact, and that underscores the need not to focus on weight loss and instead focus on healthy habits, through which your body will naturally stabilize itself to whatever weight it is capable of and comfortable with carrying while performing all of the functions your active lifestyle demands of it.
5. Your body's shape and sIze is NOBODY ELSE'S BUSINESS. Really, it isn't. It's not public property. Believing that in your bones is the healthiest first step you can take toward treating it well for its own sake and not for the approval of others.

Essentially, my point is this: None of the fat people out there are accountable to your condescending opinions of whether or not they have an "excuse" or a "reason" for their size. The public health argument is ridiculous given the large numbers of people who engage in unprotected sex, don't wear seatbelts or helmets, or engage in any number of other health risking behaviors, including thin people who don't exercise or eat healthy and put themselves at risk for all of the same diseases that are supposedly reserved for fatties. The fact is, living together in a society inherently includes spreading the impact of one segment of society's behavior across the entire group. That is true of the paraplegic on public assistance who was able-bodied until he rode his motorcycle without a helmet just as it is true of the diabetic on public assistance who ate too much pizza and ice cream and caused his pancreas to shut down. You can't pin it on one group, or you have to pin it on all of them. If you don't want a sensor in your car emailing reports to the government or your health insurance company every time you don't buckle it before pulling out of the parking lot, then don't expect me to have to justify my private behaviors publicly, either. Especially since you haven't got the first clue what they actually are, you just have your assumptions based on my size.

If we want to talk about behavior justification, what gives you all the right to judge, criticize, condemn, and mistreat other people around you? I don't know about you, but I was raised to treat other people with respect, and making snap judgments and condemning people for something I understood very little about was considered disrespectful and is something I was trained not to do. You talk about fat people making excuses for continuing to be fat; I wonder if you realize that you yourself are making excuses for being rude, intrusive, judgmental, or downright mean toward a group of people that you don't approve of? A core American value is live and let live, and your behavior transgresses that value; do you realize that you are using the justification behavior you're condemning us for (it's ok to be mean/intrusive/judgmental/condescending toward fat people because they're stupid/lazy/weak/morally inferior to me)?

The fact that you believe it your duty to police my body does not mean I owe you my obedience to your body policies. I wonder if you can understand that?

DesertProse — Mon Aug. 11th 2:54p.m.

If obese people are flying they should more, how about if twice the normal weight they pay twice the price as they use twice the amount of fuel to get them off the ground and keep them in the air?

Fred McPhaidin — Thu Aug. 7th 1:14p.m.

Oh, gosh, and they should give Kate Moss a discount!

scottmil — Thu Aug. 7th 1:45p.m.

Overweight and obese men and women are welcomed, accepted and understood at meetings of Overeaters Anonymous. OA is a Twelve-Step recovery group modeled after Alcoholics Anonymous. The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop eating compulsively. There are no dues or fees for membership; however, they are supported by the voluntary contributions of money and service by their members. To find a schedule of meetings in the Portland-Salem area, go to http://www.oa.org/.

barbaray — Thu Aug. 7th 1:24p.m.

You can also find information about local OA meetings at www.oregon-oa.org.

deborah ruppert — Thu Aug. 7th 2:34p.m.

I look at weight as a long-term health issue more than anything else. I exercise on a regular basis and each time I do so I refer to it as an 'investment' in my Health IRA. As I read health articles, more and more attention is given to preventative methods such as exercise that will make growing older more enjoyable and decrease my chances of developing health problems. With health care costs sky-rocketing and being self-employed this is a big concern for me.

brenda34 — Thu Aug. 7th 1:26p.m.

A very good point + idea.
Prevention is much easier + healthier way to go about this vs. treatment afterwards.

anotheropinion — Thu Aug. 7th 1:43p.m.

For the record - I don't drink, ride motorcycles, skydive or indulge in any number of other risky lifestyles other than smoking, and the health insurance I pay reflects that. At one point in my life, when I was very depressed, I gained 30 pounds but it felt so bad I lost it all in a few months.
When I see an extremely corpulent person my first internal reaction is sorrow - I know that that person is probably in pain and is struggling and will likely die prematurely.
What disturbs me most, however, is the prevalence of that body type. Every time I go to the local Fred Meyer's - which is pretty much every day - I am surrounded by fat people. Yesterday I counted 22 people in 15 minutes who fit the definition of morbidly obese.
While Oregon schools struggle to keep teachers, state police slash troopers and/or patrols and the cost of maintaining all services continues to skyrocket we continue to get fatter. There is something seriously wrong with this picture.
Someone has accused me of "Fat Hatred". Not true. I don't hate fat people, as my friends who battle their weight will attest. I do, however, dispise those who would defend it as an acceptable or even preferable lifestyle that I should support.

John in Salem — Thu Aug. 7th 3:19p.m.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand how the rising cost of education and state troopers has anything to do with people getting fatter? I'm trying to think up scenarios in which the one thing could have to do with the others, but so far I've got nothing.

I have a feeling your assumption may have something to do with the idea that fat bodies must be the result of costly overindulgence. If my assumption is incorrect, please let me know. If it is correct, then I wonder, do you realize that the socio-economic class most likely to be obese is those living near the poverty line? That doesn't really parallel with your possible fears that overconsumption of food is causing a budget crunch in the areas of education and law enforcement. Furthermore, there are many ways that our consumerist society overconsumes, with fuel being one of the big ones. Poor people, who are statistically fatter, use far less fuel that people with the means to pay for it. Also, there is the throw away attitude we have toward all of our toys and gadgets, which end up in landfills a few months after we buy them. That's not a habit of the poorer, fatter class of people, because, again, they don't have the means. Lastly, the consumption of food contributes to the economy, and to public funds; the more food people buy, the more taxes they pay on it, especially fast food (my city doesn't tax groceries but it does tax prepared foods). It is actually beneficial to the economy, and to the state of public wealth, even if not to personal health, for people to consume more food.

DesertProse — Mon Aug. 11th 3:22p.m.

What is my experience of being overweight? I have been fat, (the F word), all my life. I have good genes and in the past 8 years have only missed work because of illness twice. My colesterol and blood pressure levels are normal. So far I've been lucky.

When I was in nursery school I was the second biggest girl in the class, and grateful for that. In grade school I survived taunting, tacks on my chair, a bloody turkey claw shoved in my desk, having snowballs with rocks in them thrown at me, and a stab with a safety pin in my ample backside as I was getting off the school bus. I had boys come to sneak a peek at the scale when the nurse came into our classroom to weigh us and broadcast the amount to everyone in the room. I remember being transported home by someone's mother and 4 little boys wrestling my notebook away from me, and page by page, ripping out my homework and throwing it out the window. The mother's response? "Be careful boys, you might hurt somebody's feelngs." I came to expect that people did not and would not like me.

In the 8th grade I took the friends no one else wanted: the girl who smelled the back of her hand all day, and the horsey girl with a man's cleft in her chin, who at age 12-13 dated 26 year olds and knew a lot more about sex than anyone else our age. This was in 1960.

My junior year in high school my doctor perscribed speed and I lost 50#. I thought when I was a normal size everything would be all right, but it wasn't and I gained it back.

Throughout the years I've tried fad diets, the Jennine eat what you want, grapefruit and egg, soup, blood type, and high protein. Although I've never been the chocolate cookie and Pepsi for breakfast type and had accepted a whole-wheat lifestyle, I learned how to eat properly at Weight Watchers. I lost and gained the weight back. I went to Jenny Craig with my tax returns and eating their food and using their walking tape, lost 50#. It took more and more exercise in order to maintain. I did therapy. I joined a recovery group. I gained it back plus.

I've been up and down forever. In the last 4-5 years I've lost 80# twice. I'm 62. I can't do it anymore. There is no elasticity to my skin and no substance behind sagging flesh on my inner thighs.

To me, food is an addiction, just like smoking, gambling, alcohol, drugs, promiscuous sex, saving, compulsive shopping or cleaning.

For me, being an overweight person in this society is like being a pedophile.

MarianK — Thu Aug. 7th 11:56p.m.

My experience it a little different. I was always compared to my older sister who was extrememly under weight. I have a terrible viewof my body and I have been around 115 most of my life. Now at 41 and had a hysterectomy 2 years ago I have put on 20 pounds and I hate how I look and feel. I do work in the medical field and know this extra weight isn't good, but I still hated how I looked at 115 pounds, size 4. Boy how I wish I was a size 4.

mrsrobert — Fri Aug. 8th 12:45a.m.

About 10 years ago, after my curves had begun to gain heft and yield to menopause and gravity, I went skydiving. I was approaching 50, and taking on the body type of my mother and grandmother. A young woman instructor called out to my young, sniggering male instructor in my hearing that she bet the "fat lady" would chicken out and not jump when the time came. Eye-rolling ensued.

I didn't say anything. I did jump, fulfilling a life-long wish. It was fabulous. My instructor walked away without a word of congratulations when we reached the earth again.

I wish I had told these confident youth that I had been as young and fit as they were in my 20's, but that I didn't have the resources to skydive then. I wish I had told them that I hoped people would treat them kindly if and when their bodies began to change. I wish I had told them that maintaining the contours of youth is impossible for most people. I wish I told them that I am a creative, kind and brave person in spite of the flesh I was carrying.

I've been a health nut for most of my adult life, when I was a young woman at 120 pounds, and now that I am a hefty matron nearly 200 pounds. I eat considerably less than my slim husband or many other slim people I know. A series of injuries over the past few years make exercise very difficult, so I compensate by eating even less ? most days about 1200 - 1300 calories. And yet I continue to gain weight, slowly but surely.

I appreciate what I have heard about self-acceptance.

jessejo — Fri Aug. 8th 12:51a.m.

Being fat is like being the beloved main character in an incredible book that too few people have read. It's being invisible and too visible all at once. It's being a punchline when you make a much better storyline. It's being intelligent, educated, compassionate, creative, considerate, charming, and funny, and knowing that far too many people in the world would only care to know that if it came wrapped in a package they found acceptable. It?s being the best audition and knowing the skinny girl will get the part. It?s being the best candidate and knowing the skinny guy will get the job. It?s being the mascot in your high school clique. It?s being left out of all the cliques. It?s scary fad diets that could kill you and only take off four pounds. It?s deadly surgery. It's eating healthy and being active and having people assume you don't. It's eating an ice cream cone in public once in awhile and feeling the heat of disapproving stares on your back, on your neck, on your fat belly and thighs. It's secret flirtations and sly requests for phone numbers from men who would love to take you for a spin but are too afraid to want you out loud. It's dubious expressions when you tell people you're a vegetarian. It's waitresses setting your friend's dessert in front of you and your salad in front of her. It's waitresses setting your dessert in front of your date and his salad in front of you. It's waitresses asking if your thin date is your brother, or asking if your fat brother is your husband. It's shopping in special stores with higher prices. It's diet advice from random strangers. It's diet advice from friends and family members. It?s diet advice from dermatologists and opthomologists and podiatrists. It?s knowing your body is public property, to be criticized, objectified, vilified, exemplified, dehumanized. It's never passing a single day without being told in some subtle or not so subtle way that, despite your college degree, successful career, happy marriage, active spiritual life, and fulfilling hobbies, your weight is the single most important thing about you and discounts all the rest to the point that you will never be acceptable to others, never a full member of society, until you can fit in the seat next to a thin person on the subway without some part of you touching them. It?s knowing that day will probably never come, no matter how little you eat.

Being fat is also like being another face in the crowd. It's eating fruit and vegetables and cheese and donuts. It's taking yoga classes and dance classes and riding bikes or hiking. It's paying bills and setting the alarm clock and hating Mondays and loving Fridays. It's watching Grey's Anatomy and wanting to reach in and slap Meredith for being so wishy washy. It's making birthday party plans with your best friend, and going out for drinks with coworkers. It's paying too much for gas, and car insurance, and your cell phone. It's getting your oil changed 5,000 miles later than you should, getting a pedicure you really can't afford, paying the minimum payment on your VISA even though you know better. It's smiling at random strangers when you're in a good mood and being too grumpy with the salesgirl when you're not. It's loving and laughing and crying and hoping and dreaming and sharing and giving. It's also petty and greedy and foolish and selfish sometimes. It's knowing you only have eighty or ninety years to make a mark on the world and coming to terms with your insignificance at a cosmic level. It's family and friends and pets and children and boyfriends and girlfriends and marriage and divorce and sex and laughter and settling for less and holding out for more.

Being fat is just like being thin, from the inside. I am you and you are me and we are all living subtle variations of the same life. Mine is only different from yours in the places that you draw the lines. When you draw the line at size sixteen in your stores, then I am different. When you draw the line at 175 lbs for health insurance, then I am different. When you see me and believe me different than you, then I am different. I am not intrinsically different. I know that is the part that scares you, that makes you angry, that makes you lash out with meanness like jokes about sinking boats and lofty rhetoric about caloric intake that we all know to be false by now. I don't know which part scares you more, however; that you might end up like me, or that you might find out that your moral superiority is a sham. I don't know whether you worry more that my fat might infect you or that my happiness might. I wish you could see it through my eyes. But you would have to see me first, and I don?t think you can.

Being fat is knowing that you?re invisible, and learning to live as if you weren?t.

DesertProse — Mon Aug. 11th 2:42a.m.

thank you DesertProse. Reading through the comments here I could feel the shaming having its effect of making me feel "less than".

I know I am more than my size. I have worth that has nothing to do with my appearance, but it is hard to remember this sometimes when you are surrounded by hate and judgment. Thank you for your beautiful post that rescued and restored me. I want to embroider it on a big, fat pillow. eileen

eileen2000 — Sun Sept. 13th 11:46a.m.

First, my obesity credentials: In August 2005, I weighed 235 pounds. I'm only 5'4" and had been obese for at least 10 years (I'm currently in my late 30s). Over a two-year period, I dieted and exercised my way down to my goal weight of 140 pounds, in the healthy BMI category.

It was brutal. It seemed to take forever. I hit a six-month plateau that almost made me give up. But eventually, I did get there. Now, just over a year later, I weigh 115 pounds. I lost more than half my body weight and have maintained this weight for six months.

I read these posts and think, "Yeah, I used to lie to myself a lot, too." Because that's what most of you are doing. You don't really only eat 1400 calories a day. You don't really exercise as much as you say/think you do. Until you are ready to be honest with yourself, you won't make the changes that you should make. I thought I was pretty healthy, "fat and fit." But no, I was just fat.

Start weighing your food and writing it down meticulously. Every single M&M. Write down how many minutes you spent walking and how far. Calculate it out. There are plenty of websites out there that will help you do this. But most of all, weigh and measure your food. Portion sizes are where most people fudge the figuring. That little scoop of pasta is probably more than the 1 cup you thought.

Stop blaming your genes. My whole family is fat too, because we all eat a lot. If genetics were really the cause of obesity, then obesity rates wouldn't have doubled in the last couple of decades. Genetic evolution isn't that fast. There weren't as many fat people in the 1950s, nor were they AS fat. It also wouldn't be so much more common in the U.S. than virtually everywhere else.

You don't have to starve or give up everything good in order to change. I ate cookies over Christmas, my big weakness. I just didn't keep snacking on them. I took out my portion, then put the rest away. No grazing unless it's on something that grew out of the ground or in a tree, in a fairly natural state. But if you must have a cookie, denying it entirely will make you cave in and eat a box of 'em. Eat more fruits and vegetables. Skip the butter sauce. Use lemon juice, garlic, and pepper on veggies. I work with a woman who complains she can't lose weight, but she basically eats meat, cheese and chocolate all day.

Eat only once your stomach actually growls, and no seconds. Serve out your portions and you're done until your stomach growls again. And don't confuse heartburn with stomach growling. I mean eat when and only when you are hungry. So what if dinner is supposed to be at 5? If you aren't hungry, visit with your family while they eat, and wait for hunger to kick in.

Don't do a formal diet. No Atkins, South Beach, grapefruit, Jenny Craig, Nutrisystem, etc. No magic pill will make you smaller. Any diet plan will work for a while, but it's not a lifestyle change. Stop drinking soda. And stop pretending you're healthy just because you feel good right now. The problem is that you are abusing your body by carrying around that weight. Eventually you will feel like crap. And you CAN do this. I didn't think I could either, but I did. By myself. No cheering section. And I feel a million times healthier.

Zelina — Mon Dec. 29th 8:17a.m.

I have a million sotries of how peopel treated me 120 pounds ago and how they treat me now. I am still morbidly overweight 290 pounds and they treat me so much better. However, many of them insist on treating me like the handicapped person I was over 100 pounds ago. It is like they don't want me to get on with my life. Another actually cried when she heard I was losing weight and wanted to know if we would still be friends. I have so many toxic relationships in my life and I know they would not be there if I were not fat. When I was normal, which was most of my life, I was listened to, not taken advantage of, and treated with respect. Obese people are disrespected,
not listened to even if they are experts, and denigrated in private. On the other hand so many people came out of the closet to be "friends" when they heard about my weight loss....where were they when I was fatter? Fat is definately the last politically correct population to make fun of.

antonia — Wed Dec. 31st 1p.m.

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