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Meat Me In Oregon

AIR DATE: Friday, February 22nd 2008
Download the mp3 for this show.
Is eating meat cool again?Meat is back. Well, it never really went anywhere, but it sure seems that change is in the air.

The embarrassment, for one, is gone. In the Portland dining scene right now -- and around the world? -- it seems that you'll find more creativity in the approach to, more pride in the presentation of, more interest in the search for new (or return to old) cuts and pieces and parts of, and in general more excitement about meat than about any other comestible.

Even a cursory glance through the menus of the newest, hippest, and most talked about restaurants around the city reads like an anatomy lesson: pig feet and tail, beef tongue and heart, livers and sweetbreads, and of course shanks, steaks, ribs, and bellies of basically anything that bleats, moos, oinks, or quacks. (And fois gras, despite the recent fracas, seems to be here to stay. Clyde Common servers are kind enough to tell us that -- if we're feeling the need -- we can add foie gras butter to anything.)

But the really interesting thing is that all of this seems to be happening at a time when bad news about recalled beef -- or about the ecology of our carnivorous appetites more generally -- hits every day.

Is it possible that the ranks of unabashed carnivores are growing even as vegetarians and vegans gain in number? Each of the butchers, chefs, ranchers, and distributors that I've talked to in the last few days pointed out that they know vegetarians who've recently fallen off the veggie wagon. (And they tell me bacon is the most common gateway drug.) Have you noticed this? If not, how does meat-crazy Portland square with the seemingly simultaneous ascendance of a meatless life? Is it possible that both are happening at the same time?

And what about you? Do you see poetry in pork belly -- as long as it's raised locally and sourced from a rancher you know by name? Have you come back to duck confit because nothing will else do? Are you honoring animals... by eating snout to tail?

Photo credit: Sean Dreilinger / Flickr / Creative Commons

GUESTS:

  • Gabriel Rucker: Chef of Le Pigeon
  • Cory Carman: Co-owner of Wallowa Valley Grass-Fed
  • Benjamin Dyer: Owner of Viande Meats & Sausage and partner in Simpatica

Tagged as: food · meat · ranching

I'm a Chef/Owner of a Restaurant and Catering company in Bend Oregon and I specialize in 'meat' especially wild game. On my menu you will see Tibetan Yak, Bison, Elk, Antelope, Lamb, Beef, Etc. But more importantly, 100% of my meat is ranched within the confines of Oregon. In fact I frequently visit the ranchers and develope a personal relationship with them. Why is this important? I have found that my customers appreciate supporting the local economy and take pride in knowng they are eating an animal that hasn't been raised in a stock yard thousands of miles away. The products i buy locally are vastly superior than any imported meat product. Oregonians have always been trend setters and now we are seeing that on a culinary level.
ChefDave —
I believe those on seemingly opposite sides of this meat spectrum have quite a bit in common with one another. Those who want a animal product-less utopia and those who want a local/sustainable meat-filled utopia both want change. It might be the equivalent of a Dennis Kucinich/Ron Paul presidential race as opposed to the real race which will take place. I believe both sides have great points and are doing something good. It is the masses in the middle that need to open their eyes.
quincey —
Quincey,

This is fascinating. I love the political parallels -- I can tell you that food-wise they ring true to me -- and I'll bring it up on the air. Thanks!
David Miller —
This return to meat, is total bourgeois hipster kitsch. Elevating something highbrow or lowbrow that was once made fun of into a supposedly interesting meal. It is the same reasons hipsters started sporting the moustache or the mullet. Elevating something pedestrian and trashy into something supposedly modern. This whole postmodern movement is boring and was already tired before it was cool.
scottmil —
I find it hard to beat a classic: bbq pork ribs. I haven't got mine as good as I want 'em to be yet, but they are getting better. Here was this years Christmas dinner:

"A Hobbs Well Done"
[img]http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m255/beerphoto/ahobbswelldone.jpg[/img]
Chad Balcom —
Oh gee I'm ever so shocked!!! Exactly the point. I don't even have anything against meat, I just think this movement is uncreative at best.
scottmil —
Responsible meat-eating means knowing where your food comes from and understanding the process that it's gone through to get to your plate. Part of this is eating meat that has been raised regionally, but another part is using all parts of the animal once it's been killed. If you haven't tried offal, you should - not only is it responsible, it's delicious!
Shannon Kirkpatrick —
The idea that people can "honor the dead animal" is the kind of crazy rationalization that just makes people feel better about themselves. We can honor animals by considering their interests and by treating them as living beings rather than snacks. Oogling over novelty meats and trendy dishes trivializes the life and death of the animal.
Dancer —
Finding pig tails, quail, beef cheeks and rabbit on the menu is just so much more exciting than finding pork loin, beef tenderloin and chicken breast. It also has a couple of unintentional results: promotes nose-to-tail eating (waste not, want not!) and invigorates a more balanced shift towards alternative commercial meat production. It shifts the paradigm from simply beef, chicken and pork to include lamb, quail, squab, rabbit and pheasant.
Brenda Crow —
I was a veggi for years and then lived abroad for some time and realized how privileged and western it was to refuse to eat something that people in many parts of the world be extremely grateful for- ever since then I have just been grateful for whatever I get.
tracib —
Today's guest keeps mentioning "Foie Grais" which has been declared illegal to sell in most cities greater or equal to the size of Portland in the USA as being animal cruelty. NPR itself has done several stories on the cruelty involved with the production of Foie Grais, yet "Think Out Loud" is providing this chief a platform to sell the public on Foie Grais. This is a bit hypocritical of OPB and a reason that some listeners might not send in their contribution pledges to OPB from the last fundraising drive.
mydogatemyemail —
give me a break. speak up if you disagree since this is a public form, but telling people not to support opb because you dont want to hear someone else's view is idiotic. opb is not one thing, stance, or idea. It is a reflection of our community, and people in our area happen to eat meat. Use opb to understand opposing views and voice your own. Censorship through lack of support is not the answer. OPB is your's as well. This is a brilliant time for you to call in and express you point of view.
marcus.guerra —
mydogatemyemail has a valid point in his/her argument - if I am not mistaken, Chicago, IL was the first city in the US to ban this product and many other jurisdiction's have followed suit. While I do agree with the premise of the post because it can be proven and I do agree that it is/was irresponsible of OPB to bring this up, I do not agree that one should "cancel" their pledge because of the 1st Amendment that we all enjoy and can voice our dissatisfaction with...
farmerziffel —
There is nothing cool or hip about killing animals. Your conversation glorifying the practice disgusts me. (The conversation yesterday about clubbing fish for sport was not much better.) I was raised on a ranch and have had my hand in raising and killing animals for food, but I have been a vegetarian for 20 years now and feel great about it. A vegetarian diet is better for my health, for the planet, and for my karma. I disagree with your premise that meat is back or that being vegetarian is passe. I would say that I'll take the answer on the air, but I'm turning the radio off now.
TomKuffner —
I've never liked 'vegetarian' or 'vegan' as nouns, because vegetarians aren't a different species from meat-eaters! I eat a primarily vegetarian diet, for health reasons and because eating plants directly is a more efficient use of the planet's resources. However, I do end up eating turkey or lamb or fish about once a week on average, when my body announces it needs concentrated protein, or when it just seems delicious.

I think that a largely vegetarian diet is one that should be encouraged, but that the occasional serving of well-prepared meat (as opposed to factory-farmed mystery hamburger) shouldn't necessarily be discouraged. I imagine that if 50% of the population ate meat once in a while, instead of at every meal, the reduction in cruelty and resource use would be greater than if 5% of the population held to a religious vegan diet.
infrarad —
I started a vegan diet last fall after reading about the health drawbacks to a meat-centric diet. I didn't make this change because I was anti-meat or anything, but I find now that hearing this show is giving me quite a sour stomach and general revolted feeling... This is new for me! I guess I can identify with how my Jewish and Muslim friends probably feel hearing that pig grease slurped in front of the microphone ;) (Background reading: "The China Study", and "Prevent and Reverse Heart Disease")
ff4444 —
Two comments:
1. Kudos to whoever chose the theme music today. Meaters. Very clever.
2. I think the current interest in meat should be seen as part of an interest in all things food. The renewed interest in cuts of meat which had been forgotten matches what is happening in produce.
Keep up the good work -
mattka —
My husband and I own a small family farm and raise hogs for our own freezer. I never thought to ask my butcher for the feet, jowls or tail. I am an accomplished cook but wouldn't have the slightest idea of how to use these parts, although I'm sure my grandmother would have so maybe we need to be educated. Is there a recommended cookbook?
AuntieD —
Fergus Henderson's "The Whole Beast: Nose to Tail Eating" and Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall's "The River Cottage Meat Book". Both Brits, of course!
Brenda Crow —
I was a vegetarian for a few years, but went back to meat eating when I went to France and realized that I could either pick the meat out of a sandwich, eat it as is, or starve. It seemed wasteful and disrespectful to the animal to pick the meat out so I ate it. That was a few years ago, and I tend to cook a lot of local free-range chicken and a bit of fish at this point...but I do occasionally splurge on some locally grown grass fed beef. I'd rather eat a locally grown and grass fed cow than some fake-meat soybean product packaged in plastic and shipped from 1000 miles or more away.
mayflyaway —
I agree with Gabriel, supporting local farmers is very important, but the way it taste going to take precedence over that local product. Once these local farms can produce high quality meat in amounts that can sustain restaurant and retail sales everyone will win. Bring the MEAT!
eagleton g —
My best meat eating experience came from Taiwan where my wife is from. I had the opportunity to have all kinds of food, especially meat that I've never had before. The most unusual meat I ate there was Chicken Feet. It's not actually very "meaty" but a lot of fun!
darinschmidt —
My husband and I raise beef cattle for breeding in Central Oregon.

We sell grass-fed beef from our ranch.

I was very interested to learn that the dangerous forms of e. coli are encouraged in an acidic gut. Cattle fed a high level of grain, such as feedlot-finisheed beef as well as almost all commercial dairies, have an acidic gut. The dangerous e. coli are not prolific in the gut of a grass fed animal.

Rebecca, Central Oregon
9 Peaks Ranch —
While interviewing for jobs fresh out of college, I was invited to a final interview at a Dim Sum restaurant. Trying to appear flexible and open, I told the president of the company, with whom I was lunching with, that I was open to trying anything. He ordered chicken feet and watched for my reaction the entire meal. I ate them while quietly struggling with my gag reflex, slowly pulling the meat off the bony toes.
Orcas Island —
It is nice to see that some providers of meat do so in a very ethical sustainable way. It is also nice that we know that Gabriel has provided us with a fine vegetarian meal at his counter so we could participate in the atmosphere of his wonderful restaurant. My wife is a life long vegetarian, I occasionally eat some fish rarely anything else that has been "something elses mother" which is my wifes definition of what constitutes "meat".

I didn't used to be much of an ecologist, a conservationist, a recycler but my concern over the ability to sustain our planet, our food sources, our economy has changed my mind dramatically on this point of view.
In a similar fashion I read in the papers that the US kills 10 billion animals a year 15% of the worlds total, "we" eat 8 oz a day which is twice the global average. Two dishes each containing 320 calories, one vegetarian, one meat has the following comparisons.
The vegetarian 320 calories requires 0.0098 gallons of gasoline equivalent
The meat 320 calories requires 0.1587 gallons of gasoline 16 TIMES AS MUCH.

For those of us who want to concern ourselves with sustainability the continued use of meat as a primary source of nutrition WILL NOT WORK

Duane
heartbietz —
In reference to Skeater's point, an interesting question to pose is:
What does he see happening to these species if they are not being eaten? Will they simply disappear from existence or thrive roaming free and in people's backyards?
Brenda Crow —
Seriously, Brenda? I hope that was a bit tongue-in-cheek, because it borders on ludicrous. If the market demanded fewer animal foods, then the industry wouldn't keep breeding masses of animals. It isn't as if these millions of poor, aimless animals would be looking for a purpose in their lives. They simply wouldn't be born.
Dancer —
I'm not talking about "fewer animals". I'm talking about no animals. I don't see a reality in the vegan utopia. I don't believe in or support mass production of animals for the purpose of eating them, nor do I support the alternative, zero production. They are both on the extreme. A world where animals and human beings roam freely without one supporting the other is ludicrous.
Brenda Crow —
The environmental argument is essentially a false premise. Currently vegetarian agriculture requires inputs in the forms of fertilizers. Where do the fertilizers come from? They are either petroleum based or animal based. Vegan composting exists but is based on mined mineral extractions from far off places. While it is true that the water requirements of animal agriculture is greater again this is a false premise, that assumes that we are choosing ONLY meat versus ONLY vegetables raised on the land. This is also based on the premise of massive feedlots versus monoculture a terribly unsustainable agriculture. Moderation!
moderation —
For me an my family eating, and meat eating, is more than a meal--it's a lifestyle. I'm very lucky to have been born and raised in Eastern Oregon. The majority of the meat we eat is responsibly hunted wild game; we also butcher our own chickens and the occasional hog or steer. I realize this form of eating is not an option for everyone, but I feel both more connected to my food and knowlegable about it. Well-prepared venison or wild turkey is absolutely delicious and quite sustainably raised and grass (and browse) fed! I think responsible eating is a matter of knowing what you are doing and where it comes from rather than specific allowances and prohibitions. I'm glad to hunt or butcher my own meat, but CAFO feedlots frankly turn my stomach.
E.O.Sarah —
prior to the recent recalls, I have been "picky" about where I shop and purchase meat and produce. I want to know where my meat and produce comes from and am willing and able to pay for grass fed beef. I recommend the dvd, "King Corn" to see how politics and agriculture has changed what cattle are fed.
lorose
lorose —
In my nursing program in college we had a nutrition lab in which we had to sample different kinds of diets including ethnic foods. This was in the South and my lab partner and I prepared, cooked, served, and ate chitterlings (chittlins'). I had never done this before but my partner (who was African American) did. Although I didn't like the smell of preparing & cooking them, I have to admit I liked the taste, esp the fried chittlins'--not so much the stewed ones.
I have always been willing to try different kinds of foods but recent information about Jakob Creutzfeldt's disease certainly would keep me from trying beef brain or such. It is important to face the reality that these are animals that deserve respect. They serve a purpose in the food chain as well. Those who choose to not eat meat out of respect for the animal are living their beliefs. Similarly, I choose to eat meat to a minimal amount not because I don't think these animals should be food but because they are a heavy burden on the eart to use for food.
barbara j —
marcus.guerra has a good point. OPB needn't be held responsible for simply mentioning the subject of Foie Grais. Thinking Out Loud is simply an open forum for discussion. What you are suggesting is censorship. Even if Foie Grais is illegal in most states, OPB and the general public still have the right to know what it is and discuss it. I would rather make an educated opinion on the subject rather than simply have some draconian law laid down disallowing it from being mentioned in a public forum. You said yourself that NPR has done numerous studies into animal cruelty. Thinking Out Loud's segment on meats wasn't focused on animal cruelty, although they entertained some comments on it. The show was about 'off-cuts' of meat and more about the prominence of food and food culture in society rather than animal rights. The Foie Grais mention was in no way 'selling' people the idea. In my opinion, Friday's show did a good job of playing the neutral position around the sensitivities between carnivores and vegetarians/ vegans.
massmedia202 —

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