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Please don't equate Santa Claus to God- it is surefire loser in a religious debate. (kind of like the converting of Hitler on his deathbed.... ugh) I also did not say that non-theists aren't moral people. I have many non-believer friends who are some of the best people I know. They just follow their own inner compass and I am saying that the frailty of mankind (for ME) needs more than simply to rely on the "self". Surveys are not reliable usually, and not always indicative of truth. Firstly, most inmates claim a religious affiliation when asked because they want to align themselves with something orderly or socially acceptable. Divorce is probably greater among religious people because many non-believers don't even get married. Also, if you were a part of a very strict fundamentalist church, no wonder you have veered away. Those kinds of strident beliefs and adherence to the "fire and brimstone" notions of Christianity are far from what Jesus preached. Rational thinking, evidence is great in a science lab, but not in a religious discussion. Again, if you aren't willing to believe in the mystery and intangibility of faith, you are right to have eschewed your beliefs. And that's fine. But you cannot argue that to believe in a God doesn't take a commitment to a faith. You did that. Surely during your 46 years of missionary work you realized that God cannot be discovered through "rationalization" but in those moments of wonder and miracle. When you left those beliefs behind you became committed to not believing. 

posted 2 years, 7 months ago
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Ok, now you're losing my intellectual respect. Such a weak argument.

What experience did you have? Are you a lost boy Mormon?

posted 2 years, 7 months ago
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Am answering Tom D Ford here on his response to me about "drinking the kool-aid" Just because a person chooses to follow a certain religion doesn't necessarily mean they are powerless. Religious leaders don't have some mesmerizing and overwhelming power over us unless we let them. Only if we choose to let them! You failed to really read what I wrote. Free will, the ability to agree or disagree doesn't mean you still can't affiliate yourself with a religion or a belief system. We aren't all Jim Jones followers...

And though introduced to religion at an early age, as many, I strayed and searched and questioned and read a lot and then returned to my faith. At the end of my quest Christianity made the most sense to me. So please, Tom, we're not all a bunch of googley-eyed lost souls being brainwashed...we just choose to follow beliefs that allow us to understand our inner compass better...totally respectful of those who don't choose to make God the center of their lives. That's all.

posted 2 years, 7 months ago
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In response to both Tom and EvMack- First of all, our essential natures as human beings tell us to be both good and bad. The notion of free will, of choice, is precisely what gives us the need for God and for guidance.We need structure to keep us in line. In our human / not divine natures, we often fail at that. What religion does is provide a framework within which we can strive to be better. Not that we are inherently BAD, but by being HUMAN we have the potential for great GOOD or EVIL. When religion turns violent or harsh, it is almost always at the hand of man, not God. God created us in His image but he gave us free will. The way he sought to help us was by sending himself in man-form - Jesus Christ, who came to earth to teach us about love, forgiveness, humility and show us the "way to be". He died as was foretold, and left us with FORGIVENESS &  FAITH- and the choice of believing or not. We can accept or reject the gift of salvation. Of course, we are SO smart and find this "leap of faith" so irrational, so unbelievable, so full of fault, that it is impossible to accept the gift. As a society we now possess more and are less in need of the divine.

 I don't understand when people say they stray from "organized religion" because of its faults and rules. That's like saying I don't believe in "higher education" because of its faulty philosophies or professors. We can choose how to think, even as we involve ourselves in a formal structural learning institution or organized religion. I don't agree with everything my pastor says, much like I didn't always agree with my profs in college. But I was there to learn, and to have that structure within which to open my mind to teachings. The "faith of a child" which is often said we should strive for, doesn't mean "controlled, indoctrinated" faith...it means, to believe in miracles, in the mystery of faith as a child is capable of doing freely and which we forget how to do as we clutter our lives with the intellectual need for proof and hard facts.

I think people fear religion because it means commitment. my inner voice doesn't always tell me to do the right thing. I need more than reliance on my own thinking to get the strength to endure and explain life's tribulations.

It's always easier to doubt and fear and question than it is to say "I believe". Faith is not an easy path. But there's always grace and mercy.

posted 2 years, 7 months ago
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